Concept Diffuser

[teq]

Let me start out by saying that I am both new to this forum and to smoking hookah, but would like my first post to be one that provides insight, rather than a long list of questions.

From my understanding, diffusers provide a way of both silencing the bubbling sound and allowing the smoke to be filtered longer.

Upon browsing the forum, I noticed a few ideas for diffusers and thought I could improve upon them:







Forgive the crude mockup, but it conveys the design sufficiently.

The idea behind it is that a vacuum occurs from forcing the smoke through a submerged horizontal pipe, causing more smoke to be drawn at a time. Additionally, the smoke is filtered by a greater volume of the contents than usual, providing time for it to add flavor to the smoke.

[The King]

Well get it made and I'll be glad to test it out for ya haha

[teq]

Well get it made and I'll be glad to test it out for ya haha

I'd be glad to, but all it really calls for are three T-line connectors and some PVC tubing with holes cut in the bottom.

[cemab4y]

I found a way to get some diffusion. I got a section of copper pipe, about 10" long. I drilled some holes around the end. Then I pushed the plain end up into the hookah stem. Now, when I draw on the hookah, the smoke goes down through the smaller pipe, and breaks up into many smaller bubbles. It looks cool too! I would like to give your plastic gizmo, a run around the track. "Build a better mousetrap, etc"!!

[teq]

I found a way to get some diffusion. I got a section of copper pipe, about 10" long. I drilled some holes around the end. Then I pushed the plain end up into the hookah stem. Now, when I draw on the hookah, the smoke goes down through the smaller pipe, and breaks up into many smaller bubbles. It looks cool too! I would like to give your plastic gizmo, a run around the track. "Build a better mousetrap, etc"!!

Although you shouldn't have a problem, I would advise against using copper in anything coming in contact with your internal organs, due to the fact that you can poison yourself via copper overdose.


Furthermore, the type of diffusion I'm trying to attain is geared more toward adding flavor to the smoke than aesthetics or sound dampening, which is achieved by forcing the smoke through more liquid.

[Sonthert]

Oh, great, the diffuser threads have popped back up!

My 3 comments regarding your design is: Pressure Drop, Pressure Drop, Pressure Drop. You're going to create too large a pressure drop and get a muddy hit. Somebody, who was that anyways, took the most basic like elongated plastic cap, like a big pen cap and poked holes in it as a diffuser?

I guess I still get two comments:

Simplicity is best, the simpler the design the lower the pressure drop. My idea was a piece of towel or shirt cotton rubber-banded to the bottom of your shank.

I owe you one...I'll wait to see where this thread goes!

[hookahlife]

Hi,



These are just my 2 cents, so take them as you wish.

It seems like a good idea. I have a few comments though:

- The diffusers don’t seem too popular amongst most avid hookah smokers because it takes away from the fun of smoking by making it quiet, a lot of long-time smokers like the bubbles.

- Aside from the popularity issues your design seems really well made, but since you are new to hookah smoking you may not have considered a few things such as:
1. It will not help the smoke absorb more flavor, as this is done as soon as the smoke leaves the bowl. The amount of flavor depends very highly on your tobacco and charcoal. Mostly what a diffuser does is filter the smoke better, so you get a smoother, whiter smoke.
2. I agree with Sonthert, that the more complicated the design the more pressure loss it will create and you will get a muddy smoke. If you plan on complicating something like a diffuser in order to maintain a good smoke you would have to build in some sort of vortex fins so the smoke spins easier into the diffuser (like what they do on motorcycle air intakes). This already sounds confusing and maybe way to much work for something so simple.

In a personal opinion, I’m not a fan of the diffusers because I like the bubbles and the way the current Heba Diffusers are made, at least according to the packaging, they have to be changed every 15-30 smokes so the plastic doesn’t loose its nicotine absorbing ability. Too much hassle for me at least.

Hope this helps.

[ShishaFred]

Smoking out of PVC. I'm not too sure it's a good idea

[teq]

Okay, maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree here, or at the very least expecting different results. I'll start my question/argument with what I assume is something that can be agreed on: the liquid in the vase will affect the flavor of the resulting smoke.

From that piece of information, logic tells me that the longer a substance remains in another substance, the more properties it will retain of that substance.

So, pressure drop aside, a diffuser is probably the simplest way to coat the smoke. Correct?


(Bear in mind that my perspective is coming from smoking cinnamon flavor shisha with a few scoops of vanilla ice cream in the vase and experiencing a very sweet tasting smoke.) Edited May 12, 2007 by teq

[Rubi-WAC]

I like the idea... however it seems a bit cumbersome to actually fit in the majority of vases.

I don't like the idea of it filtering through more water. The breakdown of smoke into smaller bubbles causes more surface area of the smoke to become cooled by the ice water, but I would think that the longer the smoke lingers in the water, more of the "flavor" will retain in the water. Either way I'm going to build it too see if it would work, but it would be very small.

[teq]

I like the idea... however it seems a bit cumbersome to actually fit in the majority of vases.

I don't like the idea of it filtering through more water. The breakdown of smoke into smaller bubbles causes more surface area of the smoke to become cooled by the ice water, but I would think that the longer the smoke lingers in the water, more of the "flavor" will retain in the water. Either way I'm going to build it too see if it would work, but it would be very small.

I appreciate your input.

As far as it being cumbersome, I think it would probably come out to being the size of the inner radius of the top of the vase.

You do bring up a good point of flavor loss, but if you're using a liquid that has its own flavor, it might allow for a bit of chemistry in your recipes. That is, perse, that your choice of liquid will influence the overall taste of the smoke more than it usually would.

[Rubi-WAC]

You do bring up a good point of flavor loss, but if you're using a liquid that has its own flavor, it might allow for a bit of chemistry in your recipes. That is, perse, that your choice of liquid will influence the overall taste of the smoke more than it usually would.

That makes more sense that the flavor would come out more due the complementary flavor in the vase.

[teq]

My point exactly.

For example, most fruit flavored shisha has little to no flavor for me if I use ice water or ice water and milk. If I add a complementary juice or wine, it starts to develop some character.


As a side note, has anyone tried Creme de Menthe with mint shisha?

[oggie505#2]

Although you shouldn't have a problem, I would advise against using copper in anything coming in contact with your internal organs, due to the fact that you can poison yourself via copper overdose.

I wonder if you know that 90% of water lines in homes are copper

[teq]

Although you shouldn't have a problem, I would advise against using copper in anything coming in contact with your internal organs, due to the fact that you can poison yourself via copper overdose.

I wonder if you know that 90% of water lines in homes are copper

Of course, but water is treated, smoke isn't. Inhaling through any old copper pipe runs the risk of copper poisoning when heated or otherwise. It's when it's heated that the risk is more common, due to the fact that the expansion of the metal releases vapors used during fabrication, but that's not to say that sucking on a newly purchased copper tube can't harm you. For this reason, the best advice is simply to steer clear whenever possible.

It takes a couple gallons of water at high pressure to wash away any copper remenants that remain in a newly manufactured copper pipe..... how many smoking sessions equates to a few gallons of smoke?


To cite Wikipedia:

"All metals create odors when heated and although the metals themselves can withstand temperatures of thousands of degrees they still release harmful toxins when heated. Steel has the least odor followed by brass which tastes horrible and irritates the throat after just a few uses, followed by aluminum, on the bottom of the list is copper which is extremely reactive and can create toxic chemicals when triggered by one of the thousands of chemicals inherent in any smoke"

I'd provide the URL but it pertains to non-tobacco paraphanalia. Edited May 12, 2007 by teq

[Sonthert]

Okay, maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree here, or at the very least expecting different results. I'll start my question/argument with what I assume is something that can be agreed on: the liquid in the vase will affect the flavor of the resulting smoke.

From that piece of information, logic tells me that the longer a substance remains in another substance, the more properties it will retain of that substance.

So, pressure drop aside, a diffuser is probably the simplest way to coat the smoke. Correct?


(Bear in mind that my perspective is coming from smoking cinnamon flavor shisha with a few scoops of vanilla ice cream in the vase and experiencing a very sweet tasting smoke.)

Will the water affect the smoke? Try it without water...see what happens.

Your second piece of logic doesn't necessarily follow either...Some chemical reactions are slow, kinetically or thermodynamically, and others are fast. If it is a fast chemical reaction, the length of time it is in contact won't make a difference. If it is slow, it may make a difference. My guess is that it is fast. Real fast.

Some of the effects that you are noting are solvent-solvate reactions, the solvent in the flavor you are smoking is absorbing/exchanging with the liquid you put in the bottom. Solvent-solvate reactions tend to be fast.

[AinSophAur]

just use a number 5 thimble with holes punched in it.

like this. Just put more holes. Works perfectly.
Edited May 12, 2007 by AinSophAur

[teq]

Will the water affect the smoke? Try it without water...see what happens.

Your second piece of logic doesn't necessarily follow either...Some chemical reactions are slow, kinetically or thermodynamically, and others are fast. If it is a fast chemical reaction, the length of time it is in contact won't make a difference. If it is slow, it may make a difference. My guess is that it is fast. Real fast.

Some of the effects that you are noting are solvent-solvate reactions, the solvent in the flavor you are smoking is absorbing/exchanging with the liquid you put in the bottom. Solvent-solvate reactions tend to be fast.

You strike a very good argument, thanks.

Now I'm curious as to how much of an effect turbulence would have. But, I think we're getting way too deep in thought here. Edited May 12, 2007 by teq

[chrisrbts]

i bought the heba diffuser off of hookah-shisha.com, honestly i don't think it makes that much of a difference, if you use proper heat management and all

plus i like the bubbling noise and have the lights for my hookah that need the bubbles

[ShishaFred]

I don't think the smoke it hot enough to heat copper. No direct flame on the copper tubing. I mean, scalli's mod is made out of copper I think.

[cypherkk]

Hi,



These are just my 2 cents, so take them as you wish.

It seems like a good idea. I have a few comments though:

- The diffusers don’t seem too popular amongst most avid hookah smokers because it takes away from the fun of smoking by making it quiet, a lot of long-time smokers like the bubbles.

- Aside from the popularity issues your design seems really well made, but since you are new to hookah smoking you may not have considered a few things such as:
1. It will not help the smoke absorb more flavor, as this is done as soon as the smoke leaves the bowl. The amount of flavor depends very highly on your tobacco and charcoal. Mostly what a diffuser does is filter the smoke better, so you get a smoother, whiter smoke.
2. I agree with Sonthert, that the more complicated the design the more pressure loss it will create and you will get a muddy smoke. If you plan on complicating something like a diffuser in order to maintain a good smoke you would have to build in some sort of vortex fins so the smoke spins easier into the diffuser (like what they do on motorcycle air intakes). This already sounds confusing and maybe way to much work for something so simple.

In a personal opinion, I’m not a fan of the diffusers because I like the bubbles and the way the current Heba Diffusers are made, at least according to the packaging, they have to be changed every 15-30 smokes so the plastic doesn’t loose its nicotine absorbing ability. Too much hassle for me at least.

Hope this helps. wink.gif

I've been thinking about the vortex, not only would it "maybe" help the smoke but it'd be cool to see, if there was some way to make a base that could vortex or a clear stem that would be awsome looking me thinks. I've been working on the idea for a while but I don't have a way to blow glass so I don't know

[Sonthert]

A laminar flow hookah? Hmmm. Difficult, I should think. Of course, gas traps in labs are often designed in more or less the same way as the hookah and they seem to work, so something is going on there.

[misterbeetz]

I don't think the smoke it hot enough to heat copper. No direct flame on the copper tubing. I mean, scalli's mod is made out of copper I think.

Yeah, thats why I steer clear of the copper mods or bowls for that matter. I really think the glass mod is the better way to go. I think the ideal bowl would be a phunnel integrated with the mod extension (but all ceramic). That would be sweet.

- misterbeetz

[hookaheveryday]

The piece of T-shirt attatched with a rubberband is the first design to raise my eyebrows. Think about when you wear a tshirt in a pool. When air is trapped under a wet t shirt very small bubbles result from when the air travels through the fibers of the cotton. I'm going to give this a try when i get home from work. Very interesting idea. Edited May 14, 2007 by hookaheveryday

[schouvler]

Hi,



These are just my 2 cents, so take them as you wish.

It seems like a good idea. I have a few comments though:

- The diffusers don't seem too popular amongst most avid hookah smokers because it takes away from the fun of smoking by making it quiet, a lot of long-time smokers like the bubbles.

- Aside from the popularity issues your design seems really well made, but since you are new to hookah smoking you may not have considered a few things such as:
1. It will not help the smoke absorb more flavor, as this is done as soon as the smoke leaves the bowl. The amount of flavor depends very highly on your tobacco and charcoal. Mostly what a diffuser does is filter the smoke better, so you get a smoother, whiter smoke.
2. I agree with Sonthert, that the more complicated the design the more pressure loss it will create and you will get a muddy smoke. If you plan on complicating something like a diffuser in order to maintain a good smoke you would have to build in some sort of vortex fins so the smoke spins easier into the diffuser (like what they do on motorcycle air intakes). This already sounds confusing and maybe way to much work for something so simple.

In a personal opinion, I'm not a fan of the diffusers because I like the bubbles and the way the current Heba Diffusers are made, at least according to the packaging, they have to be changed every 15-30 smokes so the plastic doesn't loose its nicotine absorbing ability. Too much hassle for me at least.

Hope this helps. wink.gif

I've been thinking about the vortex, not only would it "maybe" help the smoke but it'd be cool to see, if there was some way to make a base that could vortex or a clear stem that would be awsome looking me thinks. I've been working on the idea for a while but I don't have a way to blow glass so I don't know

i understand where ur coming from about the complicating the airflow and filtering out the smoke but i just wanna say how can u complain about something that you have never tried? Wht u said sounds right but how do u know for sure? It's a unique idea and all its trying to do is create a thicker smoke so yah if u like to blow smoke rings they would be easier. It does suck about the nose or lack there of but owell atleast its removeable