Wooooo, Roommate Drama. Time To Vent. Again.

[Geiseric]

I've posted about issues I've had with my roommates before. I really had no idea how deep the issues went up until now, and I am going to use this post to sort out my thoughts, and get some outside thought. I rent with 2 girls, a 26 year old guy named Greg who has yet to finish his B.A. and an old high school friend named Pete. Pete and I get along very well, he is the only renter who I can still get along with. I thought Greg was becoming my friend until I got a call from my landlord today that made me realize what a piece of shit he is. First, some details about the house. It is non-smoking, but Greg, Taylor (a former renter and friend to both Greg and myself) and I all smoked hookah in it this summer. The lease covers utilities, and is the Common MN Lease form, so it is fairly standard. Fall came around, and Taylor moved into a cheaper apartment, and Pete moved in. Greg now moved in full time as well, he had been spending a lot of time at another house elsewhere, but now came home to stay. The two girls moved in downstairs.

This is where the problems started. Up until then, I had smoked in the garage with everyone. The girls wanted me to move to my room with that. So I did. A month later, I was told by the girls to move downstairs again. So I did. I set up a small lounge area in the garage, and smoked down there occasionally with friends. Then about a week later, they told me to go back upstairs. At this point, I asked them if they wanted me to stop completely, because I was willing to if it so troubled them. They said no, its fine, just go upstairs again, and keep it in your room except on rare occasions. That was fine. Everything seemed cool. Time passed. Greg was generally a self-absorbed asshole, but I was coming to tolerate him, and I was always kind and helpful to him. I helped with his laptop and PC countless times, and was generally his tech guy, for free. He would leave dishes out constantly, but say they weren't his because he always cleaned his, sleep on the couch every night rather than his room, and generally talk shit constantly. Pete and I let this slide, because hell, everyone has issues. We certainly made no mention of it to the landlord. During the oncoming semester, the girls put up their rooms for sub-lease. This was due to a combination of things, mainly because they disliked us, and their rooms were sub par, often smelling of the mold the land lords never dealt with. Winter break started, and Pete and I housed one of our former friends for a few days or so because he was up from AZ. Taylor spent a FEW nights over, mainly because he was too drunk to get home, but keep in mind he was invited over not only by me, but by Greg as well, who would often call him over to play Halo.
Aside from smoking, I am fairly clean, wash the ALL of the dished around once or twice a week, have friends over on occasion, and am almost never drunk (Once during this break. Once. That is all in all of the time I have been here, which is about 8 months). I am fairly quiet with the exception of playing guitar, very subdued and reclusive, and try to speak diplomatically as to not offend anyone (in person. Different story online)

A few days back, I got an unexpected visit from the landlord, which they excused saying they had called my other roommates, and they said they told me (an outright lie, I found out later, the only one informed was Greg) The came in to "search for a rabbit" and inspected the garage, a place I use occasionally for smoking, but was currently clean) then came into my room to "borrow a wrench" to fix a leak which didn't exist (they pointed at the release valve on the water heater), then commented on the smoking smell upstairs. I brushed it off, stating it was probably the stale state of my room, and the incense I occasionally burn in the prayer ritual of my religion. They seemed to accept this explanation. Sigh of relief. I called Greg to see if he had heard of them coming, or had called and requested it. He said no, hadn't heard anything from them.

Today, we had planned on going to eat Chinese together (Pete, Greg, and I), but just before leaving, he went into his, them came out and canceled. We went, and I didn't end up coming back until Pete went to work. When I came back, I found that Greg was gone, and so I was about to leave again with another friend, but just before, I got a call from my landlords. Overall, the call was extremely rude, convicting, unclear, and filled with direct lies, but I will paraphrase it quick for you, minus most of the bullshit and insults. The basic statement was: "You are violating your lease, and unless something changes, you will be evicted. You are housing a non-paying tenant (having friends sleep over on occasion), using more resources than your fellow roommates because of it, You are the reason the garbage is never taken out, the reason no one cleans the dishes, the reason the living room (which I never use) is always dirty. You are the reason the girls are leaving. All of your roommates have complained of you, and wish to sublease." I was intrigued, as my friend Pete and I plan on moving out and elsewhere together this summer. I said as such. They revised their story. "Greg and the girls complained of you, and want to sub-lease." I knew that Greg did not intend to move until the end of his lease, but I let it slide for times sake. Obviously they had no intention of speaking frankly or truthfully with me. I asked what I could do to remedy the situation to their standards, knowing I would get nowhere with them. They said they would have to inspect my room in two weeks for tobacco and signs of use, and I would basically (really paraphrasing here) have to become the maid for the house. I agreed, because it was better than I expected. I set a date, and hung up. Called up old Greg. Confronted him. After lying through his teeth for some time, he admitted to going to them, complaining and making a statement. I called him a *ucking piece of shit and hung up. About 5 minutes later I got a call from the landlords telling me to not do that. HE CALLED THEM AND COMPLAINED ABOUT ME CURSING HIM OUT. I had a good to hours to sit and steam before Pete got home, and when he did, we sat down and I told him what happened. He was very upset at Greg's betrayal, more sad than angry, becoming very depressed. After speaking for some time about it, we decided we need to focus on something else for a while just to lighten ourselves up,and went to go build a smoking fort outside. I have a post detailing that here: http://www.hookahforum.com/index.php?showt...t=0#entry189146

We had some good fun making it, spent around 5 hours on it, but during the process Greg came home. Ignoring me, he went next to Pete and started to try to help him. Pete just stared at him. I confronted him, asking him how he could possibly thing we could just all hang out together. He said he did nothing wrong, (he actually said he did nothing, until I pressured him with the information we already had) that he was well within his rights to complain to the landlords, and that the girls did too.
I was a little shocked that he felt no remorse for his actions at all, and told him that I had believed we were friends, that he betrayed me had done something that will always be brought up when my landlords are referenced by future ones, and that instead of seeking to work out the issue, he had sought to punish me. I than called him a worthless piece of shit not worthy of being called human and to get the *uck away from me, because he obviously didn't understand the severity of his actions. I didn't threaten him, get in his face, or do anything along those lines. I was very vulgar though . He went inside, grabbed his bag, and took off. I expect I'll hear from the landlords tommorow, and the conversatoin will be about how I threatened physical violence (I wouldn't put it past them). I once called a former roommate an asshole(REALLY! It was well deserved too, but that's another story), and got a call from them a day later stating that I was being verbally abusive and it needed to stop.

Pete and I finished up the smoke fort, talked more about how *ucked up this was, and discussed my plans. I stated that I was fed up with my landlords seeming focus on me being the root of all issues in the house (aside from the smoking thing, I can understand that, but the rest is BULLSHIT) which had gone on since the second month I lived here, and really has never stopped. I wasn't willing to live with Greg anymore, and I said that I was putting up a sub-lease notice and then moving in with Taylor. I said Pete and I could then move back in together this summer when we could look for a new place together. He wanted me to stay, because he didn't want to live with Greg alone, and he didn't want to move until September. I'm really at an impasse, I can't deal with the stress of facing that bastard every day, and being uncomfortable in the place I live at. I don't see my relationship with the landlords getting any better either. But I don't want to abandon my friend Pete. What the hell do I do?

*Quick edit: Wow, that is a lot of text! I still had a lot of rage left to write off, it seems. I also wrote a page apology to the landlords and a 2 page letter to Greg laying out why what he did was wrong. Now I have to remove all traces of hookah from the house except a box downstairs for everything I have that I can take outside to the fort to smoke. *uck, life sucks.* Edited January 8, 2008 by Geiseric

[racemyghost]

damn man, what an ass....

best of luck with your decisions dude.

[lonasindi]

do the landlords think they're your parents or what?

[Bulldog_916]

Keep your hookah stuff at your parents' house temporarily if you can or store it in your car. Just try to keep the peace, even though it's tough. When you let loose like that (as justified as it may have been) you end up alienating the very people you are trying to passify and it gets you nowhere.

What I would do personally? Move. You might actually make Pete's life easier as far as getting him off of their radar. If Pete ends up moving at the end of the lease, that's his prerogative. Everyone has dick room mates at one time or another. Discuss it with Pete and tell him that you're moving out and that if he needs a spot to stay when his lease is up or if he gets kicked out, that he has a spot with you.

[gaia.plateau]

For a roundtrip plane ticket, an 8-pack of Guinness and a new pipe, I'll kill him for you.

[Geiseric]

Ah, theres nothing about storage of tobacco products on the lease. Plus I don't live anywhere near my parents. I'm keeping it real tame with the LLs despite my disgust with them, and being overwhelmed by them constantly lying to me, which I really don't understand. I sent a signed letter of apology and a statement about what happened, which was signed by Pete, who was witness to everything, (doubt that will help much, considering they will believe him to be biased my direction, which he is, but he won't lie for me, so....) Getting along with Greg... not possible. It took everything in me not to pick a fight with him so I would have an excuse to make mince meat of his skull, and keep it to vulgarities. I said what I needed to though, so I just won't be communicating with him again. Not a problem. I see what you are saying about Pete and distance, but he is really dead set against me moving out, and he has nothing to worry about from the LLs, they like him, and all of their hate is focused on me. He didn't even receive mention when they were speaking about housing non-tenants, when he was the one that invited our friends over when it wasn't Greg or me.

As to dick roommates... yeah, but I have had a long line of 'em. Had 1 last year, 1 this summer, thought I had 2 this year, turns out it was 3. I have really hard luck with roommates, I have to start renting with people I know. The problem is there is so many cockbites out there. Can't avoid 'em.

"For a roundtrip plane ticket, an 8-pack of Guinness and a new pipe, I'll kill him for you."

... I lol'd Edited January 8, 2008 by Geiseric

[Johnny_D]

The problem with landlords is they often have the 'upper hand'.

As you have smoked in the house that has a specific no smoking clause your kinda on thin ice.

However without direct proof [or the obvious smell/discolouration of cigarettes] the landlord is going to be hard-pressed todo anything.

Most landlords really care only about 2 things... The Rent being paid & screwing you out of your deposit checks.

So I am a little surprised he has bothered to even attend - unless he thought he could screw you out of your deposit (for redecorating and fumigation lol).

I'm afraid over the years i've never seen a good story about renting. People appear to all act like assholes. Maybe because it's there first time away from mommy and daddy?

I'm afraid it's a suck it and live with it G' Even your outside smoking might be outside of the lease.

To paraphrase Mr Roosevelt - Tread carefully and carry a big stick.

JD

[HarryTheHookaMaster]

I am a landlord who rents "smoke-free" properties. JD is right, I just want to get PAID! I have had tenent "dramas" over the years. If a renter came to me bitching about a room-mate I would say "tough shit". I do not get involved in their personal lives. For me, it is a business. My renters my be cool but I am not there to be a friend, I am there to provide shelter...thats it!

I have rented to smokers over the years. I know they sit out on the porch and smoke. As long as they don't throw their "butts" all over the place-I don't care. I see the ashtrys out on the porch, I don't care...They know not to smoke indoors, if they smoke outside-fine... and I don't have a problem if they store smoking products in the rental unit....however, if the place smells like smoke- I am pissed!!!!! It take alot of $$$ to clean a rental unit after a smoker moves out (why do you think LL's hate pets so much?)

Just a point of view from a Landlord....

Harry

P.S. check your "landlord-tenent" laws in your state and know what your rights are...

[ZenSilk]

For a roundtrip plane ticket, an 8-pack of Guinness and a new pipe, I'll kill him for you.

I've got the guiness and the new-pipe, i'd love to see this guy perish.

[Tati]

From what I can see, theres only 2 things that can happen...Either you move out, or Greg moves out...

If you talk to the girls and bribe them with shiny things, they can be on your side. Together, you, Pete and the girls can complain about Greg and get him to move out...

PS: Awesome fort!!! All the snow we had melted completely in about a day. And we had about 15 inches. Edited January 9, 2008 by Tati

[TheScotsman]

Don't fret the landlord, they may talk a big game, but in this state they are very regulated (like bloody everything else). The only peg they have tro hang a hat on is being a PITA (nuisance), and it really sounds like that is what they are trying to setup.

QUIT in the garage, that is considered a "common area" and against the law to smoke in. (I think it may be wise to forget you ever did that... admitting to violation of state law is not wise, eh? )

The landlord can not require you to waive the right to prior notice, and privacy. Be sure you require proper notice if they want ot go on a fishing expedition. I would venture they don't want any sort of official record of their actions. Time to setup a webcam, and record the room when you aren't there. Catching them snooping around without cause, or leaving proper notice would be SOOOO good.

For some reason everyone thinks that a landlord can simply stick an eviction on the door with some celo-tape, and you have to move, so much is not true.

http://www.ag.state.mn.us/Consumer/housing/lt/LT_4.asp#22

In case you haven't taken a look at it.

I think documentation is starting to get critical, having records, and notes of the events will be important when/if you get to go see the local magistrate. Eviction is expensive for a landlord, and the likelihood of prevailing is not all that certain. You just don't want to get into a verbal debate about anything. tell them to send you a letter, or leave you alone. (want to raise the stakes, send a certified letter stating they need to refrain from intervention in adult tenant's personal affairs, and that any disputes other tenants may have need to be resolved by the local constabulary)

That said, time to hide behind a bush and bash the buggers kneecaps with a bat... it's ski mask season!

[HarryTheHookaMaster]

Don't fret the landlord, they may talk a big game, but in this state they are very regulated (like bloody everything else). The only peg they have tro hang a hat on is being a PITA (nuisance), and it really sounds like that is what they are trying to setup.

QUIT in the garage, that is considered a "common area" and against the law to smoke in. (I think it may be wise to forget you ever did that... admitting to violation of state law is not wise, eh? )

The landlord can not require you to waive the right to prior notice, and privacy. Be sure you require proper notice if they want ot go on a fishing expedition. I would venture they don't want any sort of official record of their actions. Time to setup a webcam, and record the room when you aren't there. Catching them snooping around without cause, or leaving proper notice would be SOOOO good.

For some reason everyone thinks that a landlord can simply stick an eviction on the door with some celo-tape, and you have to move, so much is not true.

http://www.ag.state.mn.us/Consumer/housing/lt/LT_4.asp#22

In case you haven't taken a look at it.

I think documentation is starting to get critical, having records, and notes of the events will be important when/if you get to go see the local magistrate. Eviction is expensive for a landlord, and the likelihood of prevailing is not all that certain. You just don't want to get into a verbal debate about anything. tell them to send you a letter, or leave you alone. (want to raise the stakes, send a certified letter stating they need to refrain from intervention in adult tenant's personal affairs, and that any disputes other tenants may have need to be resolved by the local constabulary)

That said, time to hide behind a bush and bash the buggers kneecaps with a bat... it's ski mask season!

The Scotsmans right, KNOW your rights! look them up for your state. In WIS I have to give 12 to 24 hour notice (depending on the situation) before I can even enter a rental unit. If they ask for tools, tell them you don't have any....

Harry the slum-lord!

[Geiseric]

Well, the Landlords cooled down a bit, basically let it go after they realized how messy and drama-filled the whole situation was, so I'm not stressed about that anymore. They really flipped around their story, and basically tried to make it seem as though they were always simply concerned about the smoke, and that they never threatened me over the other subjects braught up. Whatever, whats 4 months more anyways. I just can't smoke anymore, but come March I should be able to confortably smoke outside again.

But Pete seems to think I should just forgive and forget and be Greg's friend again. I really don't see that. I don't hate him really, or I won't when I have a few weeks to cool off, but he's shown himself to be untrustworthy. Why would I continue to be his friend? It looks like I'm stuck here till May, but I'll practically live at Taylors anyways, since he just got a new hookah. And I don't have a large one anymore. (I'll explain that later on the fort thread)

*edit* Harry: I think I would prefer that over mine. They seem to consider us children, incapable of resolving our own conflicts, which enables the shit heads to do whatever the hell they want, and then complain when they aren't happy. Edited January 9, 2008 by Geiseric

[HarryTheHookaMaster]

*edit* Harry: I think I would prefer that over mine. They seem to consider us children, incapable of resolving our own conflicts, which enables the shit heads to do whatever the hell they want, and then complain when they aren't happy.
[/quote]

Man, I go out of my way NOT to get involved in my renters lives. All I care about is my investment. Don't trash my investment and I'm cool...get in a pissing match with your roommate- you are on you own....just make sure I get my check on the first! I have enough to deal with in my own life, I really don't have the time/energy to meddle in the lives of my customers!

Its only 4 months, it will go fast...

Harry