Tazering An 11 Year Old?

[Canon]

if she decided to use physical force like hitting the child i believe that would have been wrong. tazering doesnt injure someone

[Voski]

this is wrong on the cops part

cops are told not to use a taser unless the perpetrator intends to severely harm others, such as wielding a gun

Umm... if your wielding a gun its considered to be a deadly weapon. So your gonna get shot not tazered. There was a recent article about an off duty cop getting in a traffic argument with a mother. The cop ends up shooting two rounds into her car in a parking lot when they are arguing. One of them hits her 8 year old son in the knee. The mom pops it in reverse and backs into a pole. Cop sends another 4 rounds into her windshield. I don't know what happened since there was a lot of arguing going on the topic was closed on the other forum.

[OPR234]

Regardless of the lack of injury from being tazed, it is still very unpleasant, and uncalled for in this situation. Have you ever been tazed? I have, and I can honestly say i'd rather be thrown to the ground by a cop than be tazed. If the officer was truly unable to subdue this girl, then maybe it was necessary, but I still have a very hard time believing thats the case, regardless of the girls size and weight. I believe this because as i said before, police are trained in dealing with physical confrontations, they arent handed a taser and told "use this if someones acting up". Tasers are a last-resort alternative to lethal force to be used when the situation allows, or at least thats what I think, maybe policies of tasers have loosened up. But even if the policy allowed a tazer to be used, i'm not convinced that it was the cops best judgement.

[kornkitten42]

OPR- Go back and read the posts in this to counter your arguments. I'm not going to type them out again for a person who doesn't want to read.

Mentally challanged, 170lbs, and 11 year old girl. I am 5'3 and 130lbs and 23. She has at least 40lbs on me, she is probably taller than me, and I probably won't be able to block her punches to my face since she is probably stronger then me as well, since alot of them are unusually strong!

As for the female officers carrying tasers..... In florida, all of the officers carry guns, and tasers. I don't think her being a "woman" had anything to do with it.

and by it i mean having a taser. Edited April 9, 2008 by kornkitten42

[Canon]

im going with kornkitten, it really sucks arguing with someone who asks you to bring up the same points you already have. im done arguing with you, because regardless of how anyone goes at it, i believe you will never agree with them on the subject so its a waste of time for me.

[OPR234]

Thats okay, I can admit defeat, but I still stand by my general anti-tazer views.

Besides, the purpose of this thread was to gather peoples opinions on the subject, not come at a general consensus as to whether or not it was justified, right? People get tazed every day and they dont make the news, it isn't my fault the headline is sensationalistic with the "victim"'s age.

Just to beat a dead horse, defending yourself from a punch doesn't mean you have to block it. Back in high school, all the teachers were required to take a self-defense class/seminar thing, and I was talking with one of my culinary art teachers who brought it up and she told me she could take me down if I threw a punch at her. I was at least 6-8" taller than her, so I asked how. She told me to try to punch her to show me, and when I did, she grabbed my arm and pulled it, which I was not expecting at all and I lost my balance and almost fell. She could have easily pushed me further and subdued me (she was behind me at that point) but that wasn't necessary. My point is, if a short female school teacher can do something like this, I expect an officer to have better training in self defense, and the officer in question could have done something similar. However, I'm assuming it was just a punch and not a straight up attack, so I'm not anyone to say if the officer's use of force was really justified, I just doubt it was.

I'm not trying to take the argument any further, and im sorry for reiterating old points . I have a habit of arguing just for the sake of the debate, so please don't take it personally when I don't agree with you.

[Johnny_D]

Well,

All I can add to this is I have 3 daughters and none of them are 170lbs But I can tell you that my 14 year old is surprisingly stronger than her mother, taller and can [during those hormonal times] being rather intimidating.

My middle one is short but strong. My baby who is 9 this year could single-handedly take down a water buffalo even though she's a short ass

I'm afraid that also looking [From a British perspective, with our chavs] that a tazer looks like it's a great idea. Apparently, currently, only Armed Response units within the UK carry them. I personally hope it gets rolled out to all cops.

And I would advocate it's use as soon as the little bastards start throwing F's into the police.

The world is going to hell in a hand cart and I'm afraid I fully blame the left wing, hand-wringing, sandle wearing lentalists for it.

JD Edited April 10, 2008 by Johnny_D

[Ralleac]

if she decided to use physical force like hitting the child i believe that would have been wrong. tazering doesnt injure someone

Tazers have been lethal in hundreds of cases over the last few years. I believe they have their place in law enforcement, but their dangers shouldn't be dismissed to the point that they are being used as frivoulously as they have been lately.

In this situation it may have been appropriate, as I've seen how dangerous and unreasonable some mentally handicapped children can become. My ex. used to work with them, and I didn't really like that she stuck with the job all that much due to some of the injuries she sustained. Edited April 10, 2008 by Ralleac

[Texico]

The world is going to hell in a hand cart and I'm afraid I fully blame the left wing, hand-wringing, sandle wearing lentalists for it.

I take offense at this. I wear sandles, and I would greatly enjoy tasering many of the people I know for being left wing, hand-wringing, lentalists (and many other people in the world, too). Maybe I'm my own special breed of f***ed up? haha

[vetbridge]

Can't believe nobody has brought this up:
How many 5 year olds could you take in a fight?

[*HOT&SMOKING*]

im going with kornkitten, it really sucks arguing with someone who asks you to bring up the same points you already have. im done arguing with you, because regardless of how anyone goes at it, i believe you will never agree with them on the subject so its a waste of time for me.

I totally agree....

We brought up points supporting the officers actions again and again for people who just saw this thread and started argumenting, and we really don't want to bring it up again....

Its done now and lots of points have been made....please don't somebody start argumenting again.....or atleast until you have read everything threw and found a flaw or something in our arguments.

Thank you

-H&S

[gaia.plateau]

Uh... lol.

Yes, you've brought up the same 2 or 3 tired points again and again... thanks for pointing that out. You've done this while ignoring the dozen-or-so equally-or-more valid points that everyone else has made. *Golfclap*.

The more violent power given to police forces, and the more open their license to use it, the more brutality becomes legitimized in society. The results of this are that crime increases and becomes more intense, and that a region or nation itself becomes more aggressive societally.

Look at capital punishment, in every US territory that has it, there is exponentially more murder and violent crime than in territories that don't use it. When children grow up in a society that uses violent force as the first and best option for solving problems, they learn what they see, and you end up with a nation of thugs and criminals.

Using another American example: the US has the most forceful security regulations in the Western world; every cop carries a gun, shotguns in cars, tasers on hips ready to use if anyone looks at them the wrong way. And the US has more people in prison per capita than any country on the planet.

I realize we're all afraid of criminals and bad people coming in the night to steal our MP3 player, so it's tempting to advocate the use of brutal force to protect ourselves. The problem is, who protects us from our protectors?

The unique problem of tasers is that cops are using them left and right for nearly no reason. It's depressing to look at the past year, and of all the taser incidents in the news, this recent use of a taser on an 11 year old girl is the most justifiable. The American kid asking John Kerry questions, the British guy on the bus minding his own business, the late Canadian in the airport minding his own business, the American guy that was pulled over and didn't immediately jump on the ground, the Californian that was Muslim... and those were just the ones caught on tape. There's something very wrong with society when the people who are charged with protecting it are electrocuting its members every chance they get.

People advocating the use of tazers as a first and best option for handling difficult situations need to be tazered, not as part of a police exercise, but at unawares, for no other reason than standing too close a demented cop, that which is rapidly becoming the majority. Edited April 10, 2008 by gaia.plateau

[NickReppinThe909]

I'm afraid that the little bastard deserved it.

In my day if i'd have done that to a teacher I'd have got the fucking Cane or a board eraser over the head.
Kids have no respect.

And I don't have to worry about it happening to my kids - They were brought up correctly and would never behave like this...... See how that works?

JD

+1 bro im 21 and i still dont fuck up because even though hes 55 and lives across an ocean i know my dad wont hesitate to take the company jet and come give me a few with his belt

i was always brought up to listen to my elders and especially authority figures and if thats not instilled in you by your parents you going to be a future ex-con

tasering has no long term adverse effects and i usually get in situations when im on patrol that tasering will cause less injuries than trying to physically restrain a suspect (both to the suspesct and to myself or my FTO) Edited April 11, 2008 by NickReppinThe909

[gaia.plateau]

i was always brought up to listen to my elders and especially authority figures and if thats not instilled in you by your parents you going to be a future ex-con

More like a future oppressed drone

Just because someone is in a position of authority over you doesn't make them right.

tasering has no long term adverse effects and i usually get in situations when im on patrol that tasering will cause less injuries than trying to physically restrain a suspect (both to the suspesct and to myself or my FTO)

Unless it kills you.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/...eath/index.html

[NickReppinThe909]

that death was most likely because of ventricular fibrilation due to the officer using it not being properly trained

and dont get me wrong im not saying that just because they have authority they are right but until you know they are not right you should still respect them regardless

[*HOT&SMOKING*]

Uh... lol.

Yes, you've brought up the same 2 or 3 tired points again and again... thanks for pointing that out. You've done this while ignoring the dozen-or-so equally-or-more valid points that everyone else has made. *Golfclap*.

The more violent power given to police forces, and the more open their license to use it, the more brutality becomes legitimized in society. The results of this are that crime increases and becomes more intense, and that a region or nation itself becomes more aggressive societally.

Look at capital punishment, in every US territory that has it, there is exponentially more murder and violent crime than in territories that don't use it. When children grow up in a society that uses violent force as the first and best option for solving problems, they learn what they see, and you end up with a nation of thugs and criminals.

Using another American example: the US has the most forceful security regulations in the Western world; every cop carries a gun, shotguns in cars, tasers on hips ready to use if anyone looks at them the wrong way. And the US has more people in prison per capita than any country on the planet.

I realize we're all afraid of criminals and bad people coming in the night to steal our MP3 player, so it's tempting to advocate the use of brutal force to protect ourselves. The problem is, who protects us from our protectors?

The unique problem of tasers is that cops are using them left and right for nearly no reason. It's depressing to look at the past year, and of all the taser incidents in the news, this recent use of a taser on an 11 year old girl is the most justifiable. The American kid asking John Kerry questions, the British guy on the bus minding his own business, the late Canadian in the airport minding his own business, the American guy that was pulled over and didn't immediately jump on the ground, the Californian that was Muslim... and those were just the ones caught on tape. There's something very wrong with society when the people who are charged with protecting it are electrocuting its members every chance they get.

People advocating the use of tazers as a first and best option for handling difficult situations need to be tazered, not as part of a police exercise, but at unawares, for no other reason than standing too close a demented cop, that which is rapidly becoming the majority.

SURE!! I totally agree with you that the more violence is that is used the more violent they are ..etc...

And I also agree that cops shouldn't just use their tazers willy nilly. But I was just justifieng this situation.

And the " who will protect us from the protectors" , I agree with that as it plays a big roll in south africa and essentially is what everyone here, in south africa, should be asking.

So ya, was just justifieng this cops use of the taser ,but I essentially agree with all that you said...

-H&S

[Yamin]

If I ever saw an 11 year old that weighed 170 I'd cut the bacon off her back.

[gaia.plateau]

If I ever saw an 11 year old that weighed 170 I'd cut the bacon off her back.

Shouldn't you be taking your knife to the parents?

[*HOT&SMOKING*]

^^^^^^

Yes he should actually be taking his knife to the childs parents!

Take care of your children people!

-H&S

[Speak_In_Vowels]

im gonna go with JD on ths one

you know what is sad? is that this country is becoming such a puss. i mean look at it,
in the last generation children WOULD NOT have acted this way.

you know why? because they were raised by people who made sure their children were afraid to do anything wrong.
kids have quickly gained an upperhand on parents, what was once called spanking is now abuse.
society is pathetic. they make everything so sugar coated for children that it is no wonder they rebel as often as they do today.

now if the majority of society had it their way, the child would have had a slap on the wrist,
and i guarantee that the next day she would act the same way because of a lack of discipline.

its so sad how soft the world is getting.

[Dr. Atkins]

I knew ignorance was abundant on this forum, but every time there's a topic dealing with non-hookah life the intensity always blows my mind.

Tazer=lethal force. If you think that is legit to use under all but the most extreme conditions, you need to go back and take a biology class. The electrophysiology of the heart, and even brain, is in a very delicate balance, and can easily be disrupted irreversibly. Is it a surprise, then, that tazers have killed so many?

Furthermore, to those of you arguing that this cop had the right because of the danger posed by a mentally deranged 170lb 11 year old with bizarro strength, don't you think you're being a little lax with your expectations from today's law enforcement? If they are going to be dealing with 250lb+ people with a good deal more experience with violence than a child, perhaps they should learn a few tricks to be able to subdue an 11 year old, no matter how unruly.

And please stop using 170lb as if it was some fearsome number... are you kidding me? The average cop probably weighs at least 200. If you can't handle a strong 170lb 11 year old retard, and get your nose broken, then you deserve to be fired, not to be allowed to use your tazer.

[Johnny_D]

yer, but we know what happens when these people get sex nuts and retard strong. I'm very sorry to say Mrs JD has been that end of things a few years ago.

And you know what? It's time to stop fuck assing around. I said it before i'll say it again. Too much pansying around. If these little fuckers step out of line then they get hurt.

Kids today have no respect because they have no fear. It's that fucking simple.

[Stuie]

Kids today have no respect because they have no fear. It's that fucking simple.

RESPECT MY AUTHORI-TY!!!!!!

Parent's get punished for correcting their kids...1 spanking gets you 5 years.

[Dr. Atkins]

I'm not arguing against getting hurt.
I'm arguing against using potentially lethal force.
The difference is stark.

[derogatory]

Personally I'm kind of against the use of tasers by law enforcement unless pepper spray has been deployed and found ineffective. There are way too many videos out there of officers misusing there tasers and they are a sadistic weapon. We aren't cattle we're human beings. I definitely think the brat should have got the spray first though. I wouldn't risk getting bit and scratched by a child who may have some kind of communicable disaease and I wouldn't expect a teacher or an officer to take that risk either.