My last post

[Aggroman]

I've enjoyed participating in this forum.  I've learned a lot and hopefully have helped some others with some advice.

However, Mr Bubble's recently-posted regulations have left a very
bitter taste in my mouth.  After reading the following paragraph I
have decided that I no longer want to be part of a forum with policies
like this:

--------------------------
1. No discussions of illegal drug activities.  The culture of hookah
smoking in our generation is meant for tobaccos. In Egypt, whose
culture played an important part in the development and nurturing of
the machine and rituals have stricter drug laws than we do. A typical
fine/penalty for having weed on your person can be an automatic 2 years
in jail and 10,000 Pound fine. You will probably make new friends while
serving time. Friends you don't want Mom and Dad to know about.  This
further reinforces the notion that massell is smoked in the machine.
The last thing we need are casual surfers to visit us and leave with
the impression we are a bunch of pot heads. If you want to slime
yourselves, that is fine. Go somewhere else to do it. Just don't slime
our past times.
--------------------------

I personally have no huge desire to discuss drug use with with
hookahs.  I've made a few replies on the subject and found it
interesting to hear what others had to say about it.

That said, I have no time for any website that is interested in focing
discussion to conform with the personal preferences of those who happen
to control it.  I think smoking hookahs with quicklights is awful
and shouldn't be "encouraged" by discussion of it... but that's MY
preference.  Many traditional hookah smokers are equally shocked
by the idea of adding anything but water to the vase, but that's THEIR
preference.

Truly a shame that a website that's supposed to promote open-minded
discussion refuses to allow the same discussion I could freely engage
in at any bus-stop here in the corrupt little dictatorship I presently
live in.

I wish you all the best, in the meantime, and I will occasionally check
back to see whether these present Stalinist regulations have been
retracted.

Ma al Salama

[ioannisds]

Dude, I agree with Mr. Bubble 100%.  I think you are misunderstanding the reasons behind the ban of talk like this.  First off, I don't believe for one second that Mr. Bubble would mind open discussion of WHATEVER on the board.  When it comes to drug use, I think we run into quite a few problems.  There are A LOT of kids running around here.  By kids I mean the under-18 crowd.  Not that there's anything wrong with that...  Technically they shouldn't be here anyway (but it's cool).  Here are the problems, methinks:1) We are starting to get bombarded with posts like "i got some mad herb to smoke in da hookah, can sumone tl me how to set it up propperle for a kiler buz?"  2) I can just see Jr. getting caught reading about how to smoke weed in his hookah on the forum, mum and dad flipping out, calling the Feds, letting the local news know about this naughty forum, etc, etc, etc.  3) Please God, no...[img]http://www.hoghoggidyhog.com/stoner.jpg[/img]I'm sure there are other issues relating to the youngsters being here as well.  These are just off the top of my head. Now, hypothetically, let's say that we were all a bunch of mature adults who could chat about drug use and the hookah without it getting out of hand.  Ok, even forget the mature part.  Why should we allow this?  Let's pretend that I visited a forum that is for people who smoke pipe tobacco.  Sherlock Holmes style.  Do you think I could get away with asking about marijuana use (or any drug for that matter) on such a board?  No f**king way.  It is not because these guys might approve/disapprove.  IT IS JUST NOT THE PLACE.  There are LOADS of places on the web dedicated to the fine art of getting stoned.  The Hookah Forum is not one of them. Would you go to a physics class and ask about American history?  Or go to church and ask how to sacrifice a chicken in a Satanic ritual?  Yes, ma'assell and cannabis are really that different, as far as I am concerned.  I don't think online Communism is not what Mr. Bubble is condoning here at all.  We are just a bunch of hookah fanatics who want to keep the ritual as traditional as we can, quick-lights and all.  Regardless of what technique you use when you smoke, the heart of the ritual is the ma'assell.  Not any kind of drug... besides the negligible amounts of nicotine.  Hookahs are not for smoking weed.  That's it.  Yeah, you could smoke weed out of a hookah.  You could also smoke weed out of an apple, a cigar, or a toilet paper tube.  But these items were not meant for it, just like our beloved hookahs were not.I will stop now, as I have important sh*t I have to do.  Like try out another Starbuzz flavor .

[[LB]]

AMEN ionnadis, amen. This forum isnt about how to use one kind of weed
paraphonilia- Its about hookahs+shisha. If you wanna defend weed then
head on over to the yahooka forums- where on the front page youll find
a communist flag and the word nigger and whatever else comes with the
marijuana culture.

[url="http://www.yahooka.com/forum/showthread.php?t=76452"]http://www.yahooka.com/forum/showthread.php?t=76452[/url]

[Sonthert]

I play bridge professionally when I am not making tobacco or running a lounge. It is considered rude to discuss bridge hands between the play of each one. People still do it, and it is tolerated a little, but when it continues incessantly frequently people will point out that it is rude. I think this is still the same thing here...we have adopted a code of conduct and ethics because we don't want to impose on other people and their values. I believe that's what this is. If you want to talk during, before or after bridge hands, don't play professionally. If you have a problem with the ethical code that has been adopted, start your own page. I don't want it to sound like I'm some raging Nazi, I agree with your attitude. We have to limit some things because they interfere with, annoy or endanger the group as a whole.As I said before, just because we have the freedom to type nasty words doesn't mean we should do it or even tolerate others doing it. I swear like a sailor sometimes and playing bridge with people who are all at least 55 or 60, you can't do it, they will be offended; we must be respectful of the majority's feelings to some degree. Freedom of speech doesn't necessitate people to be a$$h01es.Fact is, with any society, they are rules. I guess if you don't like it, you can go live in the desert, by yourself, which is what you are doing. Sorry to see you goMay we all know peace

[MR Bubble]

Thank you for your support, Brother-men. While I can understand Aggro's frustration, I have made unpopular decisions before. I have been man enough to reverse decisions after careful consideration as well. I think I have made a good one here that will benifit the forum in the long run. We flourished for a couple years as it was, and we recently have had a lot of controversy. My rocket scientry tells me to do what works and I'm happy the most of you are behind me.
Just for the record, let me put this at another angle as to why I made this rule:
The practice/art/culture of hookah smoking is a rather new, unconventional practice in a country who's citizens don't normally take onto new concepts. Especially concepts that are part of another countries culture. These are looked at with suspicion. In fact, if you don't think the FBI or other government beauracuracy isn't watching this board, then you need to look at the past several years. But anyway, as hookah smokers, what are people's usual reaction when we try to explain what it is we're doing? Especially the ones 30+ years old? I wouldn't be doing this if I hadn't visited the Middle East. So, as long as there is discussion of ILEAGAL substances going through our hoses, the "old opinion" will still be alive and well. We don't need that. The majority will never be swayed, but I think enough of the level headed minority of uneducated folks out there will come around after we win their trust. It is the trust that we mean no harm for our society, our society's children, and what they percieve to be our "way of life."
So there.
Once again, Thanks guys.
MR Bubble

[Marcus9638]

Frankly, none of the few pot references that I've come across here ever made me blink, or even bothered me.  I'm not a pot smoker any longer but I consumed plenty of it in my 20s and early 30s, so I'd never be one to try and censor or disqualify anybody else's comments or opinions on the subject.  It just doesn't bother me.That being said, I do understand that the premise of this site is to encourage and enjoy an ongoing discussion of all things shisha/hookah.  Other than the rantings of the occasional militant devotee, everybody on here seems pretty cool.  There appears, on the surface at least, to be a nice comraderie amongst the members.  Most every post is directly hookah-related.  And the ones that are off-topic are handled well in the Serious Discussion Forum.  I'm probably over sensitive to what I see as any form of censorship.  I like Aggroman's posts;  they're intelligent and well-written. I dislike others.  When I encounter the posts I don't like, I usually just ignore them and move on because an opinion doesn't necessariliy affect anyone.  Rules, however, do.  I try to live by the Golden one:  Do unto others. I understand the need for structure and for rules and guidelines, but when they're exclusionary they bother me.  No, this is not a forum for drug discussion.  And I hardly think that any casual surfer would come away from this site with the overall impression that we're a bunch of drug users.  But is the problem so rampant that we have to have a rule that might alienate the random member that sprinkles in the occasional reference to it? Let's keep alive the diversity here.

[Sariél]

Yeah, what he said. (Marcus)Very well put.

[brother812]

bye bye so long...... i have yet to figure out the "oh oh look at me i am leaving the forum because something trivial upset my feelings" posts. and though i commend the others for backing Mr. B, because he is 100% right, writing a essay over someone leaving because the forum has a code of conduct is silly. every forum i have ever visited that was worth visiting more than once had rules. otherwise you had a bunch of punks doing nothing but speaking l33t and flaming one another.

[Donkeema]

[quote name='brother812']bye bye so long...... i have yet to figure out the
"oh oh look at me i am leaving the forum because something trivial
upset my feelings" posts. and though i commend the others for backing
Mr. B, because he is 100% right, writing a essay over someone leaving
because the forum has a code of conduct is silly. every forum i have
ever visited that was worth visiting more than once had rules.
otherwise you had a bunch of punks doing nothing but speaking l33t and
flaming one another.[/quote]

Perfection !!

Hadafiz man ...

[[LB]]

brother is right- except you have to understand bubble is trying to
prevent that type of thing from happening. Sure i think the majority of
us have made a hint or small reference to pot but when a new memeber to
the forum on his first post opens up a thread that says

"Which hookah is the best to smoke weed out of"
thanks guys-

i dont think he really gets what the forum is about. As for aggroman,
your being a whiner- if you come to this forum you come to learn about
hookahs and shisha, then just keep your weed discussion to yourself-
you can still smoke it sure just doesent need to be made a major
discussion after all this is the Hookah Shisha forum

[ioannisds]

I vote we stop posting to this thread, as I can just tell it is going to get out of hand.  If Aggroman (or anyone for that matter) wants to leave, go right ahead.  I don't think there is a reason for these "goodbye" type post though...  

[MR Bubble]

I will give it a few more days, then close this thread. Whatever opinions are out there need to be expressed. Thank you all for expressing your feelings about a controversial subject in an adult manner. If you want to leave, you are most welcome to give a "goodbye" note. Just lets me know who not to expect back.
Cheers, B-men.
MR Bubble

[HookahDuck]

I read this when it was first posted. I decided not to respond, because
I hoped that this thread would just die. Unfortunatly, it didnt.




There isnt much I can say that hasnt already been said. What did you
hope to accomplish aggroman? That Bubble would try to talk you into
staying, and change the rules? I am a member on several forums, and
this one is quite liberal compared to many. Some Chevy discussion
forums will ban members for posting a thread asking about a ford
motor(Litterally...). Now, that was harsh IMO, but that doesnt make it
unreasonable for the mod to do. Just like that is a CHEVY forum, this
is a HOOKAH forum. Like it was stated above, there are plenty of forums
who openly discuss marijuana and other substances without moderation.
In fact, when I first started getting into smoking, I searched for
hookah forum's, and I was dissapointed in that most of the ones I
visited were all about smoking marijuana out of them... That wasnt what
I wanted.

There are many forums that I've left for one reason or another over the
years. It certainly isnt the end of the world. Hopefully you'll find a
place more accepting of what is contributing to the stigma surrounding
water pipes in much of the world.

I have yet to smoke my hookah's in public, without many people giving
me dirty looks, and women asking me if I could go smoke my bong some
where else. Its irritating.

[dizzing]

aggroman is simply venting his frustration at having his ideas (some of
them) squelched.  i can't say i didn't feel somewhat similarly,
but ultimately i'd have to agree with mr bubble that this is for the
best of the forum.  plus, one look at that picture up towards the
top should be enough to make anyone wanna stop smoking weed

if aggroman feels the need to leave, it's regrettable, but his
decision.  i only hope that everyone else can learn to accept what
this forum should be about and that we can all learn to get along in
peace

[cafedelmar]

I think it's a good rule. I also think its a good idea for people to voice their reasoning for liking or not liking this.
IMO, closing this thread will be more a form of censorship than anything else. So what if it gets out of hand? There is nothing wrong with controversy, or disagreement. No one wants it, but hey atleast it adds a little bit of spice to the forums. As long as there are no personal threats being made, and discussion of the topic continues in a way similar to how it has been already, I don't see any problem with it continuing.
There is a proper way to deal with disagreement, and I feel Mr. Bubble has taken that way so far. As a moderator, he feels that an [b]illegal[/b] practice should not be discussed on the board, and has given his reasons why. It is a legitimate stance, he has given good, fair reasons for his decision. If you don't agree, you're welcome to leave and go join a Marijuana forum instead. While you're at it, you should also inform the government of the country you choose to live in that you are leaving and moving somewhere where Marijuana is legal and permitted, because they too are a Stallinist regime (assuming you live somewhere where weed is illegal.)

[dizzing]

just wanted to say, i think it's more fascist than communist, but i
dunno.  i'm sure neither hitler nor stalin were big fans of the
reefer.  

[Sonthert]

I hope I have made some serious contributions to this discussion or at least well taken by my fellow hookah-smokers. Unfortunately HookahDuck raised a question in my mind which should be banned for many reasons (and this is starting to sound a little glooommmy!) but I just wanted to be a little stupid:Q. What kind of Chevy is the best to smoke weed out of?A. All of themI feel like that's the mentality that these r0dents are approaching this site with. They are looking for rejection, not approval.

[Sariél]

Chevy van.With carpet kit, mini fridge, and "Sin Bin" airbrush paint job....and that's all right with me...

[HookahDuck]

Definatly an 80's astro van, with a rattle-can "Rasta" paint job.

[mushrat]

Thank you Sammy Johns...

[Sonthert]

Lowered Monte Carlo, 7-Up Green (2nd choice fuschia), chopped top, hydraulics, smoke gray leather interior, custom rims, DVD/entertainment center, 455 CI, 3 hookers in the back seat. Sweeeet!

[dizzing]

i never had anything along those lines, but i always enjoyed my 87
buick lesabre... that thing was the pimpin'est grandma car ever 

[MR Bubble]

You're a girl if you never had a '74 Dodge Dart Swinger, slant-6 engine with shag on the doors, seats and dash. Tap-a-tap-tapa-tapa-tapa-tapa-tap--poof.
Anonymous

[Sonthert]

I rode in that thing once. The gas gauge never worked, so my stepmother was always runnin' out of gas. The Dart, not the Monte Carlo
 

[dizzing]

ah reminds me of the time i went with a friend to pick up a dart for
someone, we had to drive down to the middle of NOWHERE ( i live in west
virginia, which is bad enough, but i mean, this was NOWHERE)  ...
when we got it, it turned out there was no gas tank, so we ran a fuel
line up under the steering column into the car and into the back seat,
where we had somebody sit with a can of gasoline in his lap holding the
fuel line in place.  boy, i have a new respect for american
engineering, uh, sort of