dizzing Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 okay, so i've been reading through all these recent reviews of tangiers tobacco, and taken note of the fact that everyone says to use less heat than usual. mr bubble described using 3/4 of a three kings disc to great effect (adding the other fourth after a little bit). i have seen people comment that their usual of "2 goldens" is too much for this tobacco. this strikes me as bizarre, because i only use about 3/4 of a 3-kings disc on nakhla, and it's usually just about perfect. in fact, the way mr. bubble described smoking his tangiers is the way i would describe how i smoke nakhla. that's actually how i smoke most anything, i think, but it's been so long since i've had anything other than nakhla that i couldn't say for sure . i know when i had japanese coals, two squares was almost always perfect for a medium sized egyptian ceramic bowl. the bowl i'm using now is the cup shaped mya, it's almost hemispherical in its design.so anyway, am i using too little coal generally?it's worth pointing out that the 3-kings discs i use are the 40mm variety - the same my local cafe uses. in fact, my local cafe uses whole coals placed on the center of the bowl, and my friends and i all commented on how harsh the smoke was. what are we doing wrong? is our altitude at fault? that seems a bit extreme, but we do live in the mountains, at an elevation of i believe (um... *goes to check some weather page that might actually know*) around 1000 feet. perhaps not quite, but i'm not really sure. this is an enormously hilly region, located in the mid-to-north-western part of the appalachians. anyone have any ideas? it seems odd that hookahs are so touchy to heat like that when you guys describe using 2 entire coals to heat yours. if i did that i'd be vomiting within 10 seconds, and my friends would all probably feel about the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzing Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 [wow, those two pargraphs are almost exactly the same size.] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HookahCaterpillar Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 I use a whole coal and usually have 2 whole coals with one bowl one right after another. Its never harsh except of course with certain brands like tangiers. In my experience its all about the size of the holes in your foil, how good you broke up the tobacco, if you packed in the tobacco too hard, etc... I poke pretty small holes using a standard thumbtack not a toothpick and not the poker that is attached to some tongs. You can control the heat pretty well with the size of the holes. If there are big hunks of tobacco then that also causes harshness. I think its a major waste of money to go breaking up your charcoals what are you going to do with a 1/4 piece of charcoal?? How can you control breaking it into 3/4 pieces in my experience they just crumble up anyways. Tangiers is harsh shisha so i dont buy it, yes it may taste pretty good but that only lasts for 10 minutes then its unbearable not to mention the shisha is more expensive then nahkla or al waha which i have never had harsh except for orange and a few other flavors. Tangiers comes with big ass twigs and all kinds of things in there and ppl wonder why it gets harsh?? So my answer is its not the shisha smoker's fault tangiers tobacco is harsh and noone should have to go breaking up charcoal and all that just to get a mediocre smoke from the tangiers...ITs tangiers fault and they need to improve there recipe of shisha. Pack shisha loosely in the bowl with plenty of air flow poke tiny holes(ive seen ppl use a knife to poke there holes!) Break it up dont allow hunks of tobacco After all that if you shisha is still horribly harsh dont buy the brand again. my $.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mushrat Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Um..ok..each to his own and all, but I must comment on one thing you said. I have NEVER found a stem or twig in Tangiers thicker than a thick thread. These are usually attached to a leaf end. Nakhla on the other hand includes logs not only from the leaves, but from the tobacco plant itself. If you are going to be critical of a product I suggest you be accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheeshabum Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Interesting. A few weeks ago I decided to try using only one coal, quik lighting kind. I was finding that any brand of shisha I smoked was too harsh, and I wasn't enjoying the smoking for awhile. Even with Al-Fakher, which I think is mild. As soon as I went to one coal, I was tasting each flavor so much better, and it wasn't making me cough in the slightest. Same ammount of smoke thickness too, since now I take more in. I'd learned by chance as a long distance runner for 30 some years that if I got winded, I would blow out all the air from my lungs while still running. What happened is that it relaxed my lungs from the usual breathe-in-breathe -out pace and the lungs functioned so much better. I'd do this onceevery 5 minutes while running fast. The same I've tried when smoking the hookah. If I take a big puff it irritates the lungs, so what I do is to inhale regular, blow out all the air with force and then I'm able to take in all kinds of smoke , taste it really nicely and no harshness at all.I'll bet this sounds weird, but for me , it works. (I was born at the end of the 6th month of pregnancy, maybe the lungs didn't develope enough?) (Or maybe the brain??) Sheeshabum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HookahCaterpillar Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 In my experience(as i stated) i have found huge hunks of tobacco and twigs in my tangiers tobacco. Tangiers is very harsh shisha as said by almost everyone who has reviewed or commented about tangiers. What bothers me is everyone claims that you need to use less heat, or break up a coal, or all kinds of non sense but noone says tangiers needs to change something, i am no expert and i dont know exactly why it is so harsh but tangiers needs a serious change. Nakhla of course does have twigs here and there but in my experience very few and the twigs that do exist can easily be removed. Personally I dont buy tangiers because of the horrible harshness, i have played around with less heat, more foil, smaller holes, bigger holes, less tobacco and all have not been able to rid of the harshness. so 3$ for 250 grams of nahkla with a few twigs and no harshness vs. 11$ and horrible harshness. All in all who cares if it has twigs or not that wasnt my main point in my comments. Twigs can be removed...harshness however can not. Everything i say is my own opinion you can agree or you can disagree its nothing personal towards anyone just my own $.02. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 I actually like the cut of Tangiers. I find that I can pack a smaller amount of tobacco in a bowl than other brands and it still lasts as long. Haven't found many twigs in my bags either. Actually, the other day I found a stick the size of a pencil in my Al Fakher orange ...I have it sitting right next to my Nour rock pile.When I first got the Tangiers, it was VERY harsh like you said. It would start out great and get worse as the bowl went on. Then something happened. Either I got better at managing the heat or the tobacco got used to the humidity in my area. The smoke was thicker and there wasn't a hint of harshness. Honestly, once in a while I mess a bowl up and it is harsh. The good ones are a magical experience though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonthert Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Why would I change something? I designed the tobacco to be the way it is. You keep speaking as if the way you understand smoking hookah is the only way there is. Back in the day, we would smoke Bahraini tobacco. Very different stuff. I intended to make a tobacco that was less dense so that it packed more bowls, better and more easily. I was shooting to make a tobacco that was between Shami and Gulfii styles. I did very well in designing it, thank you. Its lighter than a Gulfii, but darker than a Shami. If you don't want to smoke it, fine. You don't have to get hostile. Jeez.And like I said before, stems and larger pieces play no part in harshness. Larger particle size increases the void fraction, which makes for a better draw, which, if anything, should reduce harshness. What scientific principle are you going to stand on to justify your position? How do larger pieces and stems make it more harsh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzing Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 okay, i would like to restate my comments, and point out that i am quite familiar with how to set up a head. there are definitely no chunks, i definitely pack it loosely, and i have tried countless types of holes - they make very little difference unless they are so big or numerous that the ash gets down into them and screws up the tobacco. sorry if this comes off as abrasive, i'm just irritated that instead of actual insightful discussion about heat management i get a ton of comments about beginner hookah setup 101. that's not what i'm asking for help with. in fact, i don't need help - i get a great smoke, i'm just saying that i get such with a much lower amount of heat than what i see discussed on here typically. and as for breaking up coals, it's easy. place two fingers on top of the coal, and your two thumbs on the bottom, use your fingernails/thumbnails to barely press into the coal right in the center on the top and bottom like /(===) /then, press your thumbs up to support the coal while leaving the nails in the same place, and then bring your fingers down (again leaving the nails in place) and apply pressure with them until the coal snaps. it will snap across a median marked by where you placed your fingernails/thumbnails, and if you are very careful to be symmetrical you will snap it almost perfectly in half. this technique works on each half to split them further, into fourths. it takes a little practice to get the hang of it, but i can do it now every single time without crumbling anything. also worth noting is that larger discs break more cleanly as a general rule, but smaller ones can be done with more care.sorry again if i came off as offensive to anyone, i slept far too late today and that always puts me in a pretty crappy mood much love, breddren! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzing Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 oh yes, and, this post had NOTHING to do with tangiers tobacco, i was talking about NAKHLA.and nakhla has humongous stems in it. millions of people seem to like it anyway.my $0.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Your post wasn't offensive at all ...I'm not sure why Tangiers was even brought up.Is your smoke as thick as everyone else describes theirs? If you are getting the same smoke with a smaller amount of coal, I need to learn your secret! I could save some money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzing Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 well, with nakhla it's kind of mediocre, but not bad. fakher of course gives me billowing white clouds. it seems about par for what people describe.as for my secret - i can't say that there is one. just try what i said about breaking the discs in half or fourths (break the 40mm discs into fourths, the 33mm into halves) and just use maybe three pieces spread out around the edges of the bowl. see how it works for you - i'm interested to know if it's just an issue of evenly distributing the heat, or if there are more factors involved (like my elevation, as i said before) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mushrat Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 Um, Tangier was brought up becasue Caterpillar decided to turn the thread into an attack on Tangiers' stuff instead of simply answering your question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HookahCaterpillar Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 obviously i cant voice my opinion in this forum ppl think im attacking someone. I answered the question but you can disagree everyone is entitled to there opinion. He asked how to reduce the harshness of tangiers i said its not what YOU can do its the fact that tangiers is naturally a little harsh. Maybe it came out wrong i didnt mean to offend anyone. I dont understand why ppl are so offended by a critique of a tobacco company this is a forum about shisha and giving your opinion about shisha isnt that crazy. Maybe its not what YOU want to hear but its my opinion you can simply say i disagree the end... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzing Posted February 9, 2006 Author Share Posted February 9, 2006 or perhaps people are offended because you DIDN'T answer any of my questions. in fact, you apparently didn't even read my post. all you did was change the topic of this legitimate discussion about heat management to a discussion about the quality control of tangiers' tobacco. go on, read my post again. then read what you just said, and compare. you'll note that what you have said has nothing to do with what i initially posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HookahCaterpillar Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 Ok if it makes you all happy you guys are right im wrong I am a total idiot so you all can sleep better tonight You can continue reaming me out for voicing my opinion or you can properly answer his question since I obviously have no clue what im talking about. Sorry i didnt answer your question I was trying to help. Noone understood my point but how about dropping it?? I am not telling you to change anything I was saying its not something you can change in your hookah packing. I dont care what you all think about me i was tryin to help sorry I came off as an ass relax smoke some shisha And dizzlings original post was about tangiers i dont understand why ppl are acting like i brought it up out of the blue-- kay, so i've been reading through all these recent reviews of TANGIERS tobacco, and taken note of the fact that everyone says to use less heat than usual. perhaps i misunderstood the original question. You all desperately need to smoke some unmentionables. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dizzing Posted February 9, 2006 Author Share Posted February 9, 2006 no! well, let's just break it down. just so nobody can say i didn't try to make my point understood. after all, it may have been written poorly to begin with. MyinitialpostwasNOTabout Tangiers',itwasaboutNakhla.The only reason i mentioned tangiers was because it brought to my attention how much coal people typically use in a session. of tobacco OTHER than tangiers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HookahCaterpillar Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 I use nahkla quite a bit and have always used 2 whole coals in one bowl. The second coal is usually a tiny bit harsh but if you put the coal in a different spot then you put the first coal and that usually solves that problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sonthert Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 Whoa, whoa, people! No big deal, its a misunderstanding. Lets remember, sometimes we type one thing and other people read it as something else. If Mr. Caterpiller doesn't like Tangiers, great! I would be worried if everyone liked it. I would think something was wrong. Everybody's opinions here are equal, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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