I Suck At All Tangiers.....

[redjako]

Compress and heat good sir.

Eric himself in a different, and very long Tangiers thread even stated he starts out with 4 Golden Canary sections (thats FOUR) to start it, then for each time they burn out, adds a single coal.

He has a different compression technique.


But honestly, if what you keep trying doesn't work, then you need to try different things.

[speel]

I get a chuckle every time I see a Tangiers wont smoke right thread, it's amazing people keep on buying it and saying yea maybe it'll smoke this time and yea sometimes you get LUCKY and find your self smoking like a champ. But all these methods and people pushing to use a phunnel bowl ( which is a good bowl ), it almost takes away the enjoyment. It's like crap I burnt it again gotta pack something else. What ever happened to packing a bowl, throwing some coals, and smoking away. Sounds like people have to stand on their toes, do a rain dance, call to the hookah gods and hold a bucket of water on top of your head to smoke Tangiers.

you obviously didn't read what redjako wrote...after so many failed attempts and then finally getting it right, even he realized that Tangiers just may be worth the effort...

the only reason why it seems ridiculous is probably because you're comparing it to AF, Nakhla, SB, or whatever...if i had to go through this much effort for any of those shishas, then it wouldn't be worth it (well, maybe Nakhla).

as so many people have said, Tangiers is in a different league...

I was referring to cxc5120's orginal post

I get what your saying about it being in a different league, but im pointing at the people who keep on buying it and wanting to kick their hookah ( cxc's comment ) and the fact that so many people complain about it. I have nothing but the highest respect for Eric's tobacco..if its made in America I'll endorse it. But the underlying fact that its so hard to get going is just mind boggling its like you HAVE to pack it a certain way and HAVE to use his funnel bowl for it to work correctly. Even Zag and Sultan Tombac and Saloum flavorless stuff which comes in tar bricks need no special way of packing and smoking. But hey if some one likes Tangiers then I say stick to what you like since smoking is about what you enjoy. I'm just pointing out the obvious.

[Arcane]

I was referring to cxc5120's orginal post

I get what your saying about it being in a different league, but im pointing at the people who keep on buying it and wanting to kick their hookah ( cxc's comment ) and the fact that so many people complain about it. I have nothing but the highest respect for Eric's tobacco..if its made in America I'll endorse it. But the underlying fact that its so hard to get going is just mind boggling its like you HAVE to pack it a certain way and HAVE to use his funnel bowl for it to work correctly. Even Zag and Sultan Tombac and Saloum flavorless stuff which comes in tar bricks need no special way of packing and smoking. But hey if some one likes Tangiers then I say stick to what you like since smoking is about what you enjoy. I'm just pointing out the obvious.

well...that i can understand. i guess people have to realize that Tangiers is a different monster and it may take you several trys to get it right. i think once you understand that and accept that you may be wasting a bit of money while you learn, then give Tangiers a shot.

if you can't stand wasting money, it might not be the right tobacco for you.

if it's just getting frustrating, i'd pack a bowl of a something you can get to smoke well...then work on packing another bowl of Tangiers. That way, at least you have something good to smoke while you're learning.

[cxc5120]

Im about to fly one of yall out here to actually show how this stuff works.. I dont wanna give up on tangiers, I need to expierence its greatness lol.

[Bye bye now have fun]

happens to the best of us i must have either packed like crap or the big cocos burned it but it was making me cough and knocked my brother on his ass

[Arcane]

Im about to fly one of yall out here to actually show how this stuff works.. I dont wanna give up on tangiers, I need to expierence its greatness lol.

you tried redjako's method? it should work. in fact, if i was using his method, i would just stir up tangiers, grab a giant handful of shisha and cram the whole ball into the bowl. then remove anything that is over the rim. foil tight, stab toothpick sized holes all over and make sure the toothpick hits the bottom of the bowl every time you make a hole.

put 3-4 coals on the bowl and have at it. it may be harsh for 5 minutes...work through it and see how it turns out.

i can also send you scoop's method, which worked out well for me. Edited April 9, 2009 by arcane

[Arcane]

oh, you could try ES' method too: http://www.hookahforum.com/?showtopic=29128

[shalowlow]

I get a chuckle every time I see a Tangiers wont smoke right thread, it's amazing people keep on buying it and saying yea maybe it'll smoke this time and yea sometimes you get LUCKY and find your self smoking like a champ. But all these methods and people pushing to use a phunnel bowl ( which is a good bowl ), it almost takes away the enjoyment. It's like crap I burnt it again gotta pack something else. What ever happened to packing a bowl, throwing some coals, and smoking away. Sounds like people have to stand on their toes, do a rain dance, call to the hookah gods and hold a bucket of water on top of your head to smoke Tangiers.

you obviously didn't read what redjako wrote...after so many failed attempts and then finally getting it right, even he realized that Tangiers just may be worth the effort...

the only reason why it seems ridiculous is probably because you're comparing it to AF, Nakhla, SB, or whatever...if i had to go through this much effort for any of those shishas, then it wouldn't be worth it (well, maybe Nakhla).

as so many people have said, Tangiers is in a different league...

I was referring to cxc5120's orginal post

I get what your saying about it being in a different league, but im pointing at the people who keep on buying it and wanting to kick their hookah ( cxc's comment ) and the fact that so many people complain about it. I have nothing but the highest respect for Eric's tobacco..if its made in America I'll endorse it. But the underlying fact that its so hard to get going is just mind boggling its like you HAVE to pack it a certain way and HAVE to use his funnel bowl for it to work correctly. Even Zag and Sultan Tombac and Saloum flavorless stuff which comes in tar bricks need no special way of packing and smoking. But hey if some one likes Tangiers then I say stick to what you like since smoking is about what you enjoy. I'm just pointing out the obvious.

I understand what your saying in its essense, but I think the biggest problem people seem to have is with acclimation. Ive smoked it in a regualr mod bowl just fine. Its kinda wierd how for some reason, it eventually just clicks and you get it right and then it never seems to be a problem again....just pack it up....even lucid....and when it smells right, then just smoke. I remember the first time I packed lucid it was harsh as heck.....you still have to pack it up pretty tight or it will burn and be harsh.

[mustang_steve]

When all else fails, pack the hell out of the sucka...that's what I do with Nak DA....it goes against logic, but it produces the best smoke ever. Literally I'll thump the bowl repeatedly until I can't fit anymore in.

I'd reccomend trying that to see what happens.

[evilded777]

Im about to fly one of yall out here to actually show how this stuff works.. I dont wanna give up on tangiers, I need to expierence its greatness lol.

I'll be in Tampa in October...can you wait that long?

[cxc5120]

Im about to fly one of yall out here to actually show how this stuff works.. I dont wanna give up on tangiers, I need to expierence its greatness lol.

I'll be in Tampa in October...can you wait that long?

Lol No : ( im just gonna like have a all day hookah day this weekend and see how I do with different methods, even though I still thought lucid was suppose to be a non hassle kinda of way for tangiers.

[annual]

I pack it tight but just a little over the rim (OG I try to add a good mound (dome over it) and then 3 or 4 rings of holes, to the bottom. 3 coco's and it hits like a beast.
I'd show you if you lived closer.

[ColibriDon]

For lucid, I pack it tighter than AF/Nakhla and just (This is written on the little sheet of paper and I can't believe I missed it at first) pack it as tight in the bowl as it is in the plastic. Throw three coco's on it and smoke.

For Tangiers OG, I use Bulldog's method, drop it in, it will be over the top, drop some foil on. A lot of holes all the way to the bottom with a toothpick. For a small bowl, I use 2 coco's. If that isn't enough, I go to 3.

[redjako]

Give us an update, and don't give up on the Tangiers.

I think most peoples problems stem from MAINLY: trying a packing method, and failing, then only SLIGHTLY tweaking that method to try to get it right. Try a completely different method, if it keeps failing, which 2-3 have been mentioned here (including mine).

The acclimation is definitely a concern for high / low weird humidity like Florida, but places other then this, acclimation seems to be a non issue for most people. I'll say MOST people, as almost all the threads I've seen for "bad batches" of tangiers seem to center in Florida or similar locales.

I believe my first batch I ever had, which was K-Cherry, I OVER acclimated it (24 hours), because here in Utah its VERY dry and Tangiers only needs 3-4 hours to acclimate properly.


Good luck sir, don't kick your Hookah


Hookah is ALWAYS 99% USER ERROR, and maybe 1% hookah problems, hahahaha (like a leak or something).

[redjako]

Couldn't Edit: Yeh, my main success came from 1) finally using the "it should be as compressed in the bowl as it is when it arrives in the package" and heating it like crazy to start, letting off on heat as it goes by.


<currently smoking Orange Soda (non lucid, whatever line that is):

Super-packed it just with my fingers, had a LITTLE bit over the rim, foil, LOTS of toothpick holes to the bottom.

I started with almost an ENTIRE coco stick (I break em up into 1/2" pieces, and I leave ONE half-inch piece out of the heating process), and after five min, I'm down to 3- one-half pieces.

I adjust based on lack of smoke / flavor (add a 1/2" coal), and too much harshness / kick to the throat (remove a 1/2" coal)

[cxc5120]

I really appreciate everyones thoughts and comments ill be sure to take note of them all. Especially seeing as the last bowl I packed was the loose sprinkle AF method.

I just wish I actually knew someone in town that actually knew what tangiers is.. Most people are like "O cool you have a hookah!?" Except for a few of my friends that know what to actually do with a hookah lol

[Arcane]

I really appreciate everyones thoughts and comments ill be sure to take note of them all. Especially seeing as the last bowl I packed was the loose sprinkle AF method.

are you sure you read the reviews and watched the vids? because i don't think ANYONE who does the guides will tell you to sprinkle Tangiers...

[cotsi95]

Just cuz theres not enough tangiers guides....



Check my sig. also have you tried the "grid" poking method on tangiers? also id use 3 cocos, tangiers actually needs MORE heat, its cause the nicotine boils off at a lower point the the tobacco so if your above the nicotine point but below the tobacco point all your smoking is mostly nicotine.

[cxc5120]

Well I used voski's method today and it started off good, but with little smoke. I had three cocos on it, 20 mins in still no smoke and losing flavor. 10 more mins got kind of nasty so i took off a coco but it was useless

[shalowlow]

Well I used voski's method today and it started off good, but with little smoke. I had three cocos on it, 20 mins in still no smoke and losing flavor. 10 more mins got kind of nasty so i took off a coco but it was useless

You should probably post pictures or a video on youtube....that might help us help you.

[cxc5120]

I will as soon as I get a video recorder

[redjako]

As a note, I just had a failed tangiers session by just packing it in very tight with my fingers.

I went back to my own method of just JAMMING the phunnel into a pile of shisha, compressing it with my palm, then "flicking" all the fluffed up stuff off.

[Sonthert]

What can I tell you?

Speel's comment encompasses the lack of understanding about Tangiers.

#1 Its not a question of luck, its a question of if you're good at it. Tangiers smokes well for everyone I know that smokes it a lot. If your technique varies or is lacking, generally underpacking, or using too much coal, it will become a question of luck as to whether the tobacco is perfectly acclimated or not. If your technique is good, its good 95% of the time. Of course, you can smoke something that's 40% water by weight and it will be more forgiving in poor technique, but it won't last anywhere near as long, as anyone who smokes Tangiers well can tell you. Extra water makes it more forgiving, but peter out faster. Its also a convenient way of making lower-cost tobacco, but putting less high cost items in it, but more water. No brand has a higher percentage of flavor, glycerine or tobacco in it than Tangiers. These are more expensive than water. Tangiers is about 17% tobacco leaf, the next closest would be Nahkla at 10%. If you want the highest quality product, its Tangiers. You may have to abandon what you think you know about hookah tobacco if you have some bad habits (that have never made a difference before). Ten years ago, sprinkling tobacco was unheard of, and in my opinion, if you're making a good quality tobacco, you don't need to worry about sprinkling. It won't scorch.

#2 You do just pack a bowl, throw coals on it and smoke away. I never acclimate. I understand that its a loaded point, but the weather does the random unpredictable change every now and then around here, too. It also smokes 2-12 times longer than anything else. Tangiers fans will tell you the same thing. The reason it does is because we don't take shortcuts regarding making the tobacco, using cheaper components or water. We also tailor our flavors towards endurance...thats a side point.

#3 I always laugh when I see that statement "You need a Phunnel" to smoke Tangiers." Its absurd. It was started by people who don't like Tangiers. Since I invented the phunnel bowl three years ago, what did we do before then? Hold it in our hand? Tangiers is the oldest hookah tobacco manufacturer in the United States. Sultan hit the market four months before us, but I had been doing R&D for three years before that. Tangiers smoked the same way in 2003 as it does now, my baseline being flavor#2, apple and #38 Kashmir Peach. The phunnel bowl only primarily improves the longevity. A little improvement in humidity sensitivity, too, but its main function is improving the longevity. If you think you need a phunnel to smoke Tangiers, you're dead wrong. Phunnels are more forgiving than standard bowls (which is one of its charms) and a fair or poor technique might be passable with a phunnel bowl, but if you use a better technique, it won't matter. In fact, in a couple of ways, Tangiers smokes better in a standard bowl.

I see several people who don't like Tangiers propagating complete myths, which leads me to believe either they don't know what they're talking about, and in some cases have never even smoked Tangiers, for whatever reason. I don't call out people that often, even when I'm 90% sure they've never smoked Tangiers. I remember a guy a couple of years saying he bought Tangiers mint and Tangiers mango and how badly they smoke and what a terrible quality tobacco it was. The only problem is, and I called him out on it, I've never released a mango flavor. He disappeared into thin air after that. Speel I know has smoked Tangiers, so I'm not really pointing this at you. Some people just don't like it, which is no surprise. Although I will say your, speel's, characterization of Tangiers is unfair. I think most people who love Tangiers will say thats its quite easy to use and their results are very consistently good.

The whole acclimation process is a little overblown, but I can't really say how weather in Sioux Falls South Dakota varies and it may need more acclimation, which is fine, but when one guy in Sioux Falls says its fine and another one says he can't get it to acclimate, I question it a little. I drove across the country, in all sorts of weather, with Tangiers, smoking in hotel rooms in all sorts of places and didn't have any acclimation problems. I did find that hard well water in near freezing weather made everything taste rusty, but other than that...

#4 If a person has crummy habits or packs bowls badly, smoke Starbuzz or Al Fahker, thats fine. Tangiers won't smoke that well for you. I've even had Tangiers fans who had reasonably fair technique, but improved it with my help and found it increased their enjoyment even more. If you want help to improve your technique, I, or another Tangiers smoker can help you and you might like Tangiers too. There are lots of videos on how to do it, but I suspect some of them are made by people that have only a fair technique or even poor techniques, but thats how they like it. I know a couple of Persian guys who intentionally underpack it to make it harsh and obnoxious. Thats what they like and Tangiers can accommodate them, and they love it. Tangiers is a three-speed bicycle. You can smoke three different ways and get three different results, where other brands have only one gear. If you are trying to bicycle up a hill in third gear and say its so much harder to operate than a one speed bicycle...don't blame me. You might not be familiar with changing how Tangiers smokes, nor the idea of different ways of smoking tobacco if you're used to all the one speed bicycles out there and thats fine if you don't want to question it. Improve your technique. I have never had somebody come down to my store and had me show them how to pack the tobacco in a bowl and then came back and said "It doesn't work still". Once people start packing bowls the way I was taught to and I still do, everybody is invariably satisfied. One kid I talked to over the phone actually ended up not liking it after his friend showed him how she did it (and she loved it). Perhaps her technique was only fair, who knows...still, people with problems packing invariably, when I show them how I do it, say "Oh, thats a lot more tobacco than I've been using." or "Thats all the charcoal you use?"

I see lots of bad habits around the Forum, honestly, and I see often two offsetting bad habits in conjunction with each other to make up for each other. There is probably one proper technique in the universal Truth, but I don't know anybody who could say what that is. I will say I see lots of bad habits. If it works for you, though, cool, thats what you should do.




So, how can I help you make your Tangiers smoking experience better?

Where did you buy it?
What flavor is it?
Do you still have the wrapping paper from the package? As another guy pointed out, you can call me.
If it still doesn't work for you, you can mail it to me, I'll look at it. Its happened about 20 times and I still haven't seen a "bad batch", but the possibility exists. If I find that its defective, I'll replace it free of charge.

Ultimately, I smoke original Tangiers, and I haven't really played a lot with optimizing Lucid, but I will help you and might even work on my technique a bit to help you and thats fine, I just need somebody to need me to do it to get me going. It might be 50% easier to use than standard Tangiers, bit I would guess since its still low-water content, its going to need to be packed fuller and acclimated a little.

Let me know what I can do to help you.

[speel]

I see several people who don't like Tangiers propagating complete myths, which leads me to believe either they don't know what they're talking about, and in some cases have never even smoked Tangiers, for whatever reason. I don't call out people that often, even when I'm 90% sure they've never smoked Tangiers. I remember a guy a couple of years saying he bought Tangiers mint and Tangiers mango and how badly they smoke and what a terrible quality tobacco it was. The only problem is, and I called him out on it, I've never released a mango flavor. He disappeared into thin air after that. Speel I know has smoked Tangiers, so I'm not really pointing this at you. Some people just don't like it, which is no surprise. Although I will say your, speel's, characterization of Tangiers is unfair. I think most people who love Tangiers will say thats its quite easy to use and their results are very consistently good.

I highly respect what you bring to the hookah industry as a whole, it's an American product that has stayed consistent as you said and I respect that, and I'm just talking out of my own experiences. I had purchased a 3 pack special from H-S I believe and 2 of them smelled like bbq sauce, yea I acclimated and what not but those are just my opinions and experiences. About the phunnel bowl comment, to me and once again this is from what I see, alot of people perceive that you have to use a phunnel bowl to get the full experience of it, if any one thought I meant it as you HAD to have it in order to smoke it I completely apologize. The only thing I point at is that Tangiers is not as universal as say nakhla or fakher. You see threads every day about how people can get it to smoke or smell right. But hey different strokes for different folks and I respect who you are and what you bring to the hookah community and culture. And if I could i'd come to your lounge and let you show me how good it is.

[Sonthert]

Fair enough, and know that, I respect you after numerous conversations. I was talking in a general sense, you understand.