As Many Of You May Know About My Issues With Tang

[JDHarding]

I don't think I would call any of the kashmir flavors good for those new to Tangiers flavors. They're good, but they're so intense that if you don't know what you're looking for, the bowl can be terrible, and you'd never even notice over the kick to the junk you just received from the nicotine.

Blueberry IMO is one of the most temperamental flavors he makes. I can't even always get it to smoke suitably. When it's right though man, it's like a freshly baked blueberry muffin, and one of my absolute favorite flavors.

I hear ya on the blueberry.. when I got my Blue Gumball, it stunk. Smelt like BBQ sauce, tasted horrible. But I was patient with it, let it acclimate, and Eric even sent me some fresh stuff that had a better smell to it. I mixed the old stuff with the new stuff, and it's now one of my favorite smokes. Loads of flavor, and tastes nothing like anything else I got. It's like raspberry.. blueberry.. odd berry flavors mixed together. It still has a funky smell, but it's awesome when smoking. That funky, odd flavor mixed with the sweet berry flavors.. there's nothing like it. If anybody out there has a good package of Blue Gumball and a smelly package, mix 'em together! Or just try the two together in a bowl first and decide if it's your cup of tea.

[Scoop]

blueberry is blueberry muffins.

blue gumball is blueberry candy and flowers.

[mattarios2]

update: tropical punch was starting to smell good, left it out over night, went to go smell it just now, and is smelling like shit again, almost smells like vanilla and soy sauce mixed.

eh

[JDHarding]

update: tropical punch was starting to smell good, left it out over night, went to go smell it just now, and is smelling like shit again, almost smells like vanilla and soy sauce mixed.

eh

I dunno.. I still feel that sometimes there are batches that didn't quite get enough flavoring, or are just rancid batches that will never smell right. All I can say is.. if it smelt good last night, try smoking it.

I don't buy all this "tobacco in shock" crap. I feel that it's mostly a flavoring issue. Some bags just didn't get enough flavoring in that particular amount of tobacco, or it didn't quite mix or mingle with the tobacco like it should have. It's an issue with consistency, not climate. If it were an issue with climate, then other shishas would be doing the same thing. I've only had problems with Tang, no other shisha. If it were climate, the shisha would begin to smell over time, not right out of the bag! Once sealed, there's nothing besides freezing it that would account for it going into "shock". Something in the mixing, or whatever is done at Tangiers to prepare the shisha, is to blame. Maybe the stuff along the edge, or on the bottom, or in the corner is not getting enough flavoring. The "small batches" they work with are not small enough, therefore the quality is diminished. I don't know how the flavoring is added to the tobacco, but it's not consistent. And it could be the flavoring itself and perhaps it's not a consistent quality. Who knows. But I deffinately don't buy these climate problems. I've never had Nak stink out of the bag, never had AF stink out of the bag, never had any other shisha stink like Tang does.

[evilded777]

I dunno.. I still feel that sometimes there are batches that didn't quite get enough flavoring, or are just rancid batches that will never smell right. All I can say is.. if it smelt good last night, try smoking it.

I don't buy all this "tobacco in shock" crap. I feel that it's mostly a flavoring issue. Some bags just didn't get enough flavoring in that particular amount of tobacco, or it didn't quite mix or mingle with the tobacco like it should have. It's an issue with consistency, not climate. If it were an issue with climate, then other shishas would be doing the same thing. I've only had problems with Tang, no other shisha. If it were climate, the shisha would begin to smell over time, not right out of the bag! Once sealed, there's nothing besides freezing it that would account for it going into "shock". Something in the mixing, or whatever is done at Tangiers to prepare the shisha, is to blame. Maybe the stuff along the edge, or on the bottom, or in the corner is not getting enough flavoring. The "small batches" they work with are not small enough, therefore the quality is diminished. I don't know how the flavoring is added to the tobacco, but it's not consistent. And it could be the flavoring itself and perhaps it's not a consistent quality. Who knows. But I deffinately don't buy these climate problems. I've never had Nak stink out of the bag, never had AF stink out of the bag, never had any other shisha stink like Tang does.

While I am not a Chemical Engineer, as the Merchant of Death is, and I personally chuckled at the concept of shock when I first read it, I will say this: from purely visual observation, Tangiers is like NO other shisha I have ever seen (not that I have seen them all, just a double handful; and no other brand ever surprised me like Tangiers). So from that standpoint alone, I am willing to accept that it might BEHAVE differently than any other shisha.

[JDHarding]

I dunno.. I still feel that sometimes there are batches that didn't quite get enough flavoring, or are just rancid batches that will never smell right. All I can say is.. if it smelt good last night, try smoking it.

I don't buy all this "tobacco in shock" crap. I feel that it's mostly a flavoring issue. Some bags just didn't get enough flavoring in that particular amount of tobacco, or it didn't quite mix or mingle with the tobacco like it should have. It's an issue with consistency, not climate. If it were an issue with climate, then other shishas would be doing the same thing. I've only had problems with Tang, no other shisha. If it were climate, the shisha would begin to smell over time, not right out of the bag! Once sealed, there's nothing besides freezing it that would account for it going into "shock". Something in the mixing, or whatever is done at Tangiers to prepare the shisha, is to blame. Maybe the stuff along the edge, or on the bottom, or in the corner is not getting enough flavoring. The "small batches" they work with are not small enough, therefore the quality is diminished. I don't know how the flavoring is added to the tobacco, but it's not consistent. And it could be the flavoring itself and perhaps it's not a consistent quality. Who knows. But I deffinately don't buy these climate problems. I've never had Nak stink out of the bag, never had AF stink out of the bag, never had any other shisha stink like Tang does.

While I am not a Chemical Engineer, as the Merchant of Death is, and I personally chuckled at the concept of shock when I first read it, I will say this: from purely visual observation, Tangiers is like NO other shisha I have ever seen (not that I have seen them all, just a double handful; and no other brand ever surprised me like Tangiers). So from that standpoint alone, I am willing to accept that it might BEHAVE differently than any other shisha.

Yes, but why would it smell right out of the bag? Once it's vaccuum sealed, there's no climate outside of freezing the stuff that would make it go into "shock" or require "acclimation". From my experience with it, acclimation simply makes the smell go away 'cause the stuff is being exposed to air. There's still a weird flavor, even after the smell has gone away. And they say Lucid needs no acclimation time, yet the first bag of Lucid Blue Gumball I bought stunk really bad right out of the bag. How's this possible unless there's a consistency problem? Lucid is supposed to not need any acclimation.

[Scoop]

I dunno.. I still feel that sometimes there are batches that didn't quite get enough flavoring, or are just rancid batches that will never smell right. All I can say is.. if it smelt good last night, try smoking it.

I don't buy all this "tobacco in shock" crap. I feel that it's mostly a flavoring issue. Some bags just didn't get enough flavoring in that particular amount of tobacco, or it didn't quite mix or mingle with the tobacco like it should have. It's an issue with consistency, not climate. If it were an issue with climate, then other shishas would be doing the same thing. I've only had problems with Tang, no other shisha. If it were climate, the shisha would begin to smell over time, not right out of the bag! Once sealed, there's nothing besides freezing it that would account for it going into "shock". Something in the mixing, or whatever is done at Tangiers to prepare the shisha, is to blame. Maybe the stuff along the edge, or on the bottom, or in the corner is not getting enough flavoring. The "small batches" they work with are not small enough, therefore the quality is diminished. I don't know how the flavoring is added to the tobacco, but it's not consistent. And it could be the flavoring itself and perhaps it's not a consistent quality. Who knows. But I deffinately don't buy these climate problems. I've never had Nak stink out of the bag, never had AF stink out of the bag, never had any other shisha stink like Tang does.

While I am not a Chemical Engineer, as the Merchant of Death is, and I personally chuckled at the concept of shock when I first read it, I will say this: from purely visual observation, Tangiers is like NO other shisha I have ever seen (not that I have seen them all, just a double handful; and no other brand ever surprised me like Tangiers). So from that standpoint alone, I am willing to accept that it might BEHAVE differently than any other shisha.

Yes, but why would it smell right out of the bag? Once it's vaccuum sealed, there's no climate outside of freezing the stuff that would make it go into "shock" or require "acclimation". From my experience with it, acclimation simply makes the smell go away 'cause the stuff is being exposed to air. There's still a weird flavor, even after the smell has gone away. And they say Lucid needs no acclimation time, yet the first bag of Lucid Blue Gumball I bought stunk really bad right out of the bag. How's this possible unless there's a consistency problem? Lucid is supposed to not need any acclimation.

i laugh at the idea of flavoring issues. i personally don't see that happening ever. tangiers is cooked, as it says on his site. i dont think any other tobacco youve smoked is a cooked black tobacco. i think cooking the water out of it is what causes humidity issues. of course, its just my guess.

lucid white grape sure needed acclimation when we took it from los angeles to south beach miami a month ago...we opened up the bag, the smell went from white grape to soy sauce in literally 30seconds. it took days for it to smell right (we did have the ac running, windows open, florida climate -> humidity kept changing in the hotel room is what im getting at).

in los angeles, ive never needed to acclimate any tangiers. regular or lucid; its good when we get it in SD and drive back.

[JDHarding]

Why cook it if it makes it so tempermental?

If acclimating it were easier, or faster, I wouldn't have any problems with it. But I got a BGB that I acclimated for 3 weeks that still stinks. I live in Washington, and we don't have major climate changes. So I dunno what's wrong. And why did the stuff from Eric smell fine, but the stuff from Hookah-Shisha smell awful? Is Hookah-Shisha freezing their Tang? Is Eric freezing it? I'd like to know what they're doing differently.

[Scoop]

Why cook it if it makes it so tempermental?

If acclimating it were easier, or faster, I wouldn't have any problems with it. But I got a BGB that I acclimated for 3 weeks that still stinks. I live in Washington, and we don't have major climate changes. So I dunno what's wrong. And why did the stuff from Eric smell fine, but the stuff from Hookah-Shisha smell awful? Is Hookah-Shisha freezing their Tang? Is Eric freezing it? I'd like to know what they're doing differently.

I do not question why Eric makes his tobacco the way he does. It works for me; I have no reason to complain.

As far as the hookah-shisha conditions...I don't think they freeze your tobacco, maybe it gets hot? I don't know enough to comment on that really, these are just hypothetical.

[JByer323]

Tangiers shisha is not the only tobacco out there that is sensitive to humidity...

I've brought back pipe tobacco from London that needed a week or so to rest before it smoke well in any way, shape or form. And if you're complaining about shisha, please, never try to pick up cigar smoking as a hobby...

[mattarios2]

it def isn't the flavoring or inconsistency of tangiers, it is definitely climate JD. The man himself Eric as well as others (scoop) have explained it many times. If it was flavoring issues then people like scoop would have issues with packages, and as we know he has no issues with acclimating. Canon and Mush too, they never seem to have any issues with their tang.

But then other people do claim they have issues.

And this is putting packaging and skill of managing heat aside. Because if it never acclimates right or smells even remotely close to what it should (with the exception of BGB) we don't get the chance to pack it and smoke it. When i do decide to smoke it anyways it tastes just like it smelt, whether it be soy sauce or bbq sauce or even nothing.

I have said before and i'll say it again, there are a few flavors i have no issues with acclimating, and then all the rest are 95% of the time horrible at acclimating.

If i remember correctly certain flavors have more trouble acclimating than others.

This would explain my success acclimating some and failing at acclimating others. When it smells right and i pack it up, i get better success every time, but if flavors don't acclimate what am i supposed to do ? ... not much.

I'd love for every tang pro to come to my house and see what i experience.

Sending it to them will do nothing because MY CLIMATE is the issue, not theirs, sending it to them would fix the problem, therefore it isn't bad batches, tangiers has very high quality control and is very consistent from what I understand, I refuse to knock on tangiers because of the issues I have had. Instead i believe it is climate related which is more or less uncontrollable on my end.

[JDHarding]

It's almost as if somebody needs to design a shisha acclimator. Put shisha in, acclimate, *ding!*, take out, smoke.

Alright, I take back my original rant about flavor inconsistency. But there's gotta be a way to get the stuff to smell right faster. Maybe some sort of mixer/airflow thing you stick it in that blows air over it while slowly mixing it all day?

[mattarios2]

I think the biggest factor is that when relative humidity fluctuates often, the shisha continually goes into shock and doesn't get a chance to stabilize. If the humidity/weather stays consistent it doesn't take very long for it to acclimate, hence why many open it and smoke it right away or within the first couple hours.

If you look at this map http://www.usairnet.com/weather/maps/curre...ative-humidity/

you can see CA rel humidity is 14, and MA is 100 (the highest out of all the states, those numbers will change if you look tomorrow because it shows current rel. humidity). Big change if you ask me, and once it gets here and gets used to the climate, the next day it could change to 20 yielding another large change and it just continues on.

[Sonthert]

When I make it, lets say the dewpoint is 35F. I seal it up. It gets to your house, the dew point is 60F. Humidity shock. Its not that your humidity is unstable, its thats its different than when the tobacco was sealed up.

That being said, the problem you guys are talking about where it smokes fine and then gets worse comes from a particular problem, you stir the tobacco up, and only take tobacco off the top. You need to think of that tub of tobacco as a cake, cut a square piece out in your mind and put it in the bowl, top and bottom. If you only use tobacco off the top, some flavors will fade quickly, since some float to the top. It can also come from not stirring well enough, too.

The tobacco is cookd to drive off the excess water...lower water content. The lower water content also makes the flavors separate a little more...its not pre-stirred and it won't stay that way. It forms into thin, little layers of different densities of flavors. If you use a long, shallow container, it will reduce this separation effect. If you use a deep, tall container, it will make it worse, if its a problem for you. If in doubt, use a container thats large and way too big, allowing the tobacco to spread out across it.

[mattarios2]

What i do is stir the shisha, then put some on aluminum foil, spread out, and stir every couple hours.

On to 2 days of acclimating tropical punch, now it smells like a mix of something sweet and vanilla frosting? lol

[Sonthert]

If you're taking the tobacco too much from the top (or the bottom) of the bulk of tobacco (bag, tub, etc.), it can end up craptacularly.

[boulderkid303]

Those are great points.

I use 3 packing points. Start in the container and use the phunnel as if it was cone for ice cream, I will have a fair-good amount of blueberry compressed into the corner of the container, then I will lift it up. At this point you have a lot of extra which is good because you can't have to little. I compress it now with the fork until its dense in the bowl as it was in the bag it came in. I make mine personally a tad bit tighter, but thats just me.

And Hi to everyone...I haven't been on in awhile.

When I make it, lets say the dewpoint is 35F. I seal it up. It gets to your house, the dew point is 60F. Humidity shock. Its not that your humidity is unstable, its thats its different than when the tobacco was sealed up.

That being said, the problem you guys are talking about where it smokes fine and then gets worse comes from a particular problem, you stir the tobacco up, and only take tobacco off the top. You need to think of that tub of tobacco as a cake, cut a square piece out in your mind and put it in the bowl, top and bottom. If you only use tobacco off the top, some flavors will fade quickly, since some float to the top. It can also come from not stirring well enough, too.

The tobacco is cookd to drive off the excess water...lower water content. The lower water content also makes the flavors separate a little more...its not pre-stirred and it won't stay that way. It forms into thin, little layers of different densities of flavors. If you use a long, shallow container, it will reduce this separation effect. If you use a deep, tall container, it will make it worse, if its a problem for you. If in doubt, use a container thats large and way too big, allowing the tobacco to spread out across it.

[mattarios2]

Well I only had a sample from HJ Eric so The entire bag went onto the foil, So I don't think taking too much from the bottom or top is an issue. When i first popped open the sample bag it smelt amazing, but after about 5-10 min of sitting out everything went sour. On to day three now and it smells like plastic.

[Sonthert]

Maybe he scooped unevenly.

I don't authorize anybody to divide up bags for that reason.

[mattarios2]

and it could still be a possibility if it smelt good at first and now smells bad?

when i first opened the bag it smell great, 5 min later smelt terrible.

[evilded777]

Don't got gettin' HJ in trouble, now!

[mattarios2]

Don't got gettin' HJ in trouble, now!

And how am i supposed to know that he doesn't authorize people to give out samples?

John is the man, but if he got in trouble, I'm sorry, but can't say its my fault.

[joytron]

why dont you just move?

[Sonthert]

and it could still be a possibility if it smelt good at first and now smells bad?

when i first opened the bag it smell great, 5 min later smelt terrible.

That is odd. The first smell was the last before humidity shock?

He's not in trouble, all I said is I don't authorize anybody to divide them up.

[mattarios2]

The first smell was the first time i opened up the zip lock bag. It was sealed for probably ... a month