Haiti

[LZ22]

[quote name='bellaxovita' date='21 January 2010 - 08:53 AM' timestamp='1264085610' post='446824']
We are a spoiled, destructive, hateful country.
[/quote]

There is so much wrong with this sentence.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704423204575017420889974094.html
Yes, the US is soooo hateful and doesn't like to donate. Keep in mind, thats just the US GOVERNMENT's contribution total, not counting the billions that will come from US citizens. China, one of the worlds biggest economies, pledged only $1 million. ONE million. That is pathetic! While the US pledged initially one hundred times that amount, and already has almost doubled its initial pledge.

Heres another article on aid to africa...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html


I'd also like to point out how rich oil countries are such as Saudi Arabia, I don't see them donating large sums of their money...

So there are some facts for you to think about before you call the US a spoiled, hateful, destructive country. We do a lot for the whole world, whether people recognize it or not, compared to many other countries throughout the world. Unfortunately, we are in debt and cannot just give endless amounts of money out. That is how it is.

[Dr. B]

[quote name='rahl071' date='19 January 2010 - 03:02 PM' timestamp='1263934974' post='446432']
I agree that the the Haiti earthquake sucks. But like you guys have said, put people before politics. Over 65% of Haitians live below the extreme poverty line. 190,000 are living with AIDS. If we are really so concerned with Haiti's status, why the FUCK did it take us this long to see to it. I don't agree with Rush; far from it. But if we cared about this country like our government claims to, what have we been doing all this time? It's great that we're helping out. But saying that we're not there for political reasons is rubbish.
[/quote]

That's akin to telling a good samaritan he should have fireproofed a person's house instead of just rushing in and saving them from the burning building. I don't agree that we should abstain from rescue for political reasons, but there's a certain amount of self-reliance involved. I don't mean to sound callous, but we (America) have been helping Haiti for decades in ways conducive to our interest in beneficial actions/transactions. Just a heads up.

[LZ22]

[quote name='Dr. B' date='22 January 2010 - 09:58 PM' timestamp='1264219138' post='447198']
[quote name='rahl071' date='19 January 2010 - 03:02 PM' timestamp='1263934974' post='446432']
I agree that the the Haiti earthquake sucks. But like you guys have said, put people before politics. Over 65% of Haitians live below the extreme poverty line. 190,000 are living with AIDS. If we are really so concerned with Haiti's status, why the FUCK did it take us this long to see to it. I don't agree with Rush; far from it. But if we cared about this country like our government claims to, what have we been doing all this time? It's great that we're helping out. But saying that we're not there for political reasons is rubbish.
[/quote]

That's akin to telling a good samaritan he should have fireproofed a person's house instead of just rushing in and saving them from the burning building. I don't agree that we should abstain from rescue for political reasons, but there's a certain amount of self-reliance involved. I don't mean to sound callous, but we (America) have been helping Haiti for decades in ways conducive to our interest in beneficial actions/transactions. Just a heads up.
[/quote]

I couldn't agree more with Dr. B's position.

[johnp]

What is it with people in this thread(?) first of all, in Haiti, like so many other places, America is helping/doing the work/sticking its neck out. Just like in all those other places, the rest of the world, who are doing nothing, in many cases, feel content to sit and criticize us for how it is going. This bothers me.


Secondly, Pat Robertson is a [i]televangelist[/i]-and makes his living preaching hellfire and brimstone-[i]not deciding what "conservatives" believe, or setting Republican or Libertarian party policies[/i]. Saying all conservatives etc. are represented by him and or agree with everything he says is ridiculous. That would be like saying all liberals follow in lock step with Jeremiah Wright. So the comparison is not only unfair but false.

Third, if this isn't political...then why are a large percentage of the beginning of this thread [i]nothing to do with Haiti[/i] and helping them but a [i]hatred for Rush Limbaugh[/i] or what the poster feels Rush Limbaugh may have said?

Next time, try listening and judge for yourself for awhile instead of what you may have heard someone else say. It might surprise you. Go ahead, when you're in your car. [i]No one will know[/i]. You'll find that all the bigotry, hatred, etc etc that you may [i]believe[/i] he says, based on things you might have heard....are simply not there.
We've gone through two years of nonstop elections, and as Rush is a [i]conservative[/i] generally, he is attacked by [i]liberal[/i] leaning politicians and media types, without regard to his [i]actual[/i] program content.
Otherwise if someone happened to hate you personally, and told all your friends that you were spouting all sorts of anti-semitic or racial or (fill in the blank) comments...wouldn't you [i]at least[/i] want them to [i]make up their[/i] [i]own minds[/i] about you instead of taking it from a guy [i]that hates you? [/i]Exactly. If you aren't a listener, you really [i]can't [/i]judge the man based on what another non-listener [i]imagines[/i] he says.

[i]Haiti is poor. If we were to pay our debt (all of it) today, it's possible we would be poorer.[/i]
What happened there is not some evil conservative plot, but a natural disaster.

Comparisons to Katrina here are off the mark.
Katrina victims were given not only warning, but aid-and the trucks were rolling before the hurricane even hit. Haiti-there WAS no warning.

Areas that heeded the warnings before Katrina did well; other areas that [i]refused[/i] to listen to the warnings, did not evacuate, and paid for it. Imagine if Haiti had known the quake was going to hit days in advance and been offered aid....would they also have refused, in order to later blame the help for being slow? one wonders...much blame lays at the Governor (and the mayor of New Orleans) IMHO for turning down help when it was first offered. Embarrassed, they attempted to blame the Bush administration [i]for their failings[/i]-when oddly enough, they were offered the same things the other states that were hit got, but [i]turned it down[/i].

It is taking [i]LONGER[/i] by the Obama administration to get aid to Haiti [than the last administration to Katrina]-[i]not the other way around[/i], as some surmise-but oddly the same people who were screaming against the last administration supposedly dragging its feet, (it didn't)-are strangely noncritical of this one.

This administration also decided that USAID should be put in charge of the help instead of the (already prepared for this scenario) military. USAID had been giving out aid for years, but they simply aren't prepared for that order of disaster or the logistical requirements that go with it.

This decision was apparently made for basically political reasons. More lives could have been saved. Sure aid is [i]finally[/i] making it there, but it could have been there the same DAY, IMHO had the administration swallowed its distaste for the armed forces and for once let them run something they are REALLY good at. Logistics on an enormous scale. USAID is coming around, but....
It is time wasted IMHO that many probably didn't have. Now, there IS military aid there now-but the armed forces are not in control of the logistics and as a result the aid is being bottle necked.
Perhaps I am wrong, but if Rush or others criticize the administration for this decision, then it is easy to see why.


[size="2"][quote name='Bsw' date='19 January 2010 - 05:51 PM' timestamp='1263941497' post='446459']
I am actually preparing to go to Haiti on Thursday. I am in the Air Force and primarily my job is a HH-60 Crew Chief. Our main mission is combat search and rescue, BUT we do respond to national disasters as well. And we will be sending some people(me included) down to Haiti shortly. I am sorry for them, although its going to be a rough TDY location to be at.

Hopefully we can help, aid, and save as many as possible.
[/quote]

Good luck brother, hopefully people won't shoot at the rescue birds like people in Katrina did...I have friends who actually had to convince survivors to leave their (NHT) pipes to board the helicopters...fire me a PM sometime-I'm in a similar line of work and bet we've worked in some of the same places.[/size]

[Rani]

[quote name='johnp' date='01 February 2010 - 11:56 PM' timestamp='1265097412' post='449103']
What is it with people in this thread(?) first of all, in Haiti, like so many other places, America is helping/doing the work/sticking its neck out. Just like in all those other places, the rest of the world, who are doing nothing, in many cases, feel content to sit and criticize us for how it is going. This bothers me.


Secondly, Pat Robertson is a [i]televangelist[/i]-and makes his living preaching hellfire and brimstone-[i]not deciding what "conservatives" believe, or setting Republican or Libertarian party policies[/i]. Saying all conservatives etc. are represented by him and or agree with everything he says is ridiculous. That would be like saying all liberals follow in lock step with Jeremiah Wright. So the comparison is not only unfair but false.

Third, if this isn't political...then why are a large percentage of the beginning of this thread [i]nothing to do with Haiti[/i] and helping them but a [i]hatred for Rush Limbaugh[/i] or what the poster feels Rush Limbaugh may have said?

Next time, try listening and judge for yourself for awhile instead of what you may have heard someone else say. It might surprise you. Go ahead, when you're in your car. [i]No one will know[/i]. You'll find that all the bigotry, hatred, etc etc that you may [i]believe[/i] he says, based on things you might have heard....are simply not there.
We've gone through two years of nonstop elections, and as Rush is a [i]conservative[/i] generally, he is attacked by [i]liberal[/i] leaning politicians and media types, without regard to his [i]actual[/i] program content.
Otherwise if someone happened to hate you personally, and told all your friends that you were spouting all sorts of anti-semitic or racial or (fill in the blank) comments...wouldn't you [i]at least[/i] want them to [i]make up their[/i] [i]own minds[/i] about you instead of taking it from a guy [i]that hates you? [/i]Exactly. If you aren't a listener, you really [i]can't [/i]judge the man based on what another non-listener [i]imagines[/i] he says.

[i]Haiti is poor. If we were to pay our debt (all of it) today, it's possible we would be poorer.[/i]
What happened there is not some evil conservative plot, but a natural disaster.

Comparisons to Katrina here are off the mark.
Katrina victims were given not only warning, but aid-and the trucks were rolling before the hurricane even hit. Haiti-there WAS no warning.

Areas that heeded the warnings before Katrina did well; other areas that [i]refused[/i] to listen to the warnings, did not evacuate, and paid for it. Imagine if Haiti had known the quake was going to hit days in advance and been offered aid....would they also have refused, in order to later blame the help for being slow? one wonders...much blame lays at the Governor (and the mayor of New Orleans) IMHO for turning down help when it was first offered. Embarrassed, they attempted to blame the Bush administration [i]for their failings[/i]-when oddly enough, they were offered the same things the other states that were hit got, but [i]turned it down[/i].

It is taking [i]LONGER[/i] by the Obama administration to get aid to Haiti [than the last administration to Katrina]-[i]not the other way around[/i], as some surmise-but oddly the same people who were screaming against the last administration supposedly dragging its feet, (it didn't)-are strangely noncritical of this one.

This administration also decided that USAID should be put in charge of the help instead of the (already prepared for this scenario) military. USAID had been giving out aid for years, but they simply aren't prepared for that order of disaster or the logistical requirements that go with it.

This decision was apparently made for basically political reasons. More lives could have been saved. Sure aid is [i]finally[/i] making it there, but it could have been there the same DAY, IMHO had the administration swallowed its distaste for the armed forces and for once let them run something they are REALLY good at. Logistics on an enormous scale. USAID is coming around, but....
It is time wasted IMHO that many probably didn't have. Now, there IS military aid there now-but the armed forces are not in control of the logistics and as a result the aid is being bottle necked.
Perhaps I am wrong, but if Rush or others criticize the administration for this decision, then it is easy to see why.


[size="2"][quote name='Bsw' date='19 January 2010 - 05:51 PM' timestamp='1263941497' post='446459']
I am actually preparing to go to Haiti on Thursday. I am in the Air Force and primarily my job is a HH-60 Crew Chief. Our main mission is combat search and rescue, BUT we do respond to national disasters as well. And we will be sending some people(me included) down to Haiti shortly. I am sorry for them, although its going to be a rough TDY location to be at.

Hopefully we can help, aid, and save as many as possible.
[/quote]

Good luck brother, hopefully people won't shoot at the rescue birds like people in Katrina did...I have friends who actually had to convince survivors to leave their (NHT) pipes to board the helicopters...fire me a PM sometime-I'm in a similar line of work and bet we've worked in some of the same places.[/size]
[/quote]

1) I have actually listened to Rush Limbaugh. He is a bigot, a racist, and he's a complete whore who intentionally spreads hatred, prejudice and division in order to line his own pockets.
2) It took FEMA 5 full days to get the first gallon of drinking water into New Orleans. Meanwhile Condelisa Rice went shopping in NYC. We got the first American flight into Haiti in the first day - you need to check your facts. Delays thereafter were due to the fact that the runway was damaged but the aid was still there waiting.
3) Been to Haiti personally? I have and so have others in this forum. Nobody here has said at any point there was some conservative evil plot. Most expressed compassion for Haiti. You on the other hand use it as an excuse to attack politics - which in my opinion kinda puts you on a par with Rush Limbaugh. .
4) Been to New Orleans? I've got family there and in Baton Rouge. The levys have always been maintained by the US Corp of Engineers as they continue to this day. Katrina simply overwhelmed and swamped them.
5) Pat Robertson claims to represent the religious right wing of the conservatives. Most give him at least lip service. Giving even a hint of respect to someone who would go on national television in the face of great human tragedy and claim it's due to a pact with the devil qualifies as a grade A lunatic by any stretch of the imagination.

6) You remind me of this 20 year old kid I used to work with. He spouted the conservative/republican agenda pretty well too. Mostly we sat around and laughed at him because quite frankly the world and politics just aren't that simple. Both sides have a lot to answer for. You can't blame everything on a past president and you can't blame everything on a current one though obviously you're going to try. Bush made horrendous mistakes - the most major being that because he refused to accept his own fallibility once he started down a bad path he refused to listen to anyone telling him to back off. So he just dug the country deeper and deeper. Obama (whom I openly support) has a lot of mess to clean up. Only time is going to tell whether or not he's up to the task. The conservative Republican movement should at least give him some credit for trying - but no. They'd rather sit around and support throwing up roadblocks instead of having a part in constructive change. Libertarians are so busy listening to their own rhetoric they haven't done a damn thing for the country except charge for admission to their party. At least neither Republicans nor Democrats have sunk that low. Get back to me when they actually do something. Then I'll take them seriously instead of just one more flag waiving corporation collecting money while masquerading as a political movement.

'Rani

[TheScotsman]

[quote name='Rani' date='02 February 2010 - 03:33 AM' timestamp='1265103190' post='449117']
[quote name='johnp' date='01 February 2010 - 11:56 PM' timestamp='1265097412' post='449103']
What is it with people in this thread(?) first of all, in Haiti, like so many other places, America is helping/doing the work/sticking its neck out. Just like in all those other places, the rest of the world, who are doing nothing, in many cases, feel content to sit and criticize us for how it is going. This bothers me.


Secondly, Pat Robertson is a [i]televangelist[/i]-and makes his living preaching hellfire and brimstone-[i]not deciding what "conservatives" believe, or setting Republican or Libertarian party policies[/i]. Saying all conservatives etc. are represented by him and or agree with everything he says is ridiculous. That would be like saying all liberals follow in lock step with Jeremiah Wright. So the comparison is not only unfair but false.

Third, if this isn't political...then why are a large percentage of the beginning of this thread [i]nothing to do with Haiti[/i] and helping them but a [i]hatred for Rush Limbaugh[/i] or what the poster feels Rush Limbaugh may have said?

Next time, try listening and judge for yourself for awhile instead of what you may have heard someone else say. It might surprise you. Go ahead, when you're in your car. [i]No one will know[/i]. You'll find that all the bigotry, hatred, etc etc that you may [i]believe[/i] he says, based on things you might have heard....are simply not there.
We've gone through two years of nonstop elections, and as Rush is a [i]conservative[/i] generally, he is attacked by [i]liberal[/i] leaning politicians and media types, without regard to his [i]actual[/i] program content.
Otherwise if someone happened to hate you personally, and told all your friends that you were spouting all sorts of anti-semitic or racial or (fill in the blank) comments...wouldn't you [i]at least[/i] want them to [i]make up their[/i] [i]own minds[/i] about you instead of taking it from a guy [i]that hates you? [/i]Exactly. If you aren't a listener, you really [i]can't [/i]judge the man based on what another non-listener [i]imagines[/i] he says.

[i]Haiti is poor. If we were to pay our debt (all of it) today, it's possible we would be poorer.[/i]
What happened there is not some evil conservative plot, but a natural disaster.

Comparisons to Katrina here are off the mark.
Katrina victims were given not only warning, but aid-and the trucks were rolling before the hurricane even hit. Haiti-there WAS no warning.

Areas that heeded the warnings before Katrina did well; other areas that [i]refused[/i] to listen to the warnings, did not evacuate, and paid for it. Imagine if Haiti had known the quake was going to hit days in advance and been offered aid....would they also have refused, in order to later blame the help for being slow? one wonders...much blame lays at the Governor (and the mayor of New Orleans) IMHO for turning down help when it was first offered. Embarrassed, they attempted to blame the Bush administration [i]for their failings[/i]-when oddly enough, they were offered the same things the other states that were hit got, but [i]turned it down[/i].

It is taking [i]LONGER[/i] by the Obama administration to get aid to Haiti [than the last administration to Katrina]-[i]not the other way around[/i], as some surmise-but oddly the same people who were screaming against the last administration supposedly dragging its feet, (it didn't)-are strangely noncritical of this one.

This administration also decided that USAID should be put in charge of the help instead of the (already prepared for this scenario) military. USAID had been giving out aid for years, but they simply aren't prepared for that order of disaster or the logistical requirements that go with it.

This decision was apparently made for basically political reasons. More lives could have been saved. Sure aid is [i]finally[/i] making it there, but it could have been there the same DAY, IMHO had the administration swallowed its distaste for the armed forces and for once let them run something they are REALLY good at. Logistics on an enormous scale. USAID is coming around, but....
It is time wasted IMHO that many probably didn't have. Now, there IS military aid there now-but the armed forces are not in control of the logistics and as a result the aid is being bottle necked.
Perhaps I am wrong, but if Rush or others criticize the administration for this decision, then it is easy to see why.


[size="2"][quote name='Bsw' date='19 January 2010 - 05:51 PM' timestamp='1263941497' post='446459']
I am actually preparing to go to Haiti on Thursday. I am in the Air Force and primarily my job is a HH-60 Crew Chief. Our main mission is combat search and rescue, BUT we do respond to national disasters as well. And we will be sending some people(me included) down to Haiti shortly. I am sorry for them, although its going to be a rough TDY location to be at.

Hopefully we can help, aid, and save as many as possible.
[/quote]

Good luck brother, hopefully people won't shoot at the rescue birds like people in Katrina did...I have friends who actually had to convince survivors to leave their (NHT) pipes to board the helicopters...fire me a PM sometime-I'm in a similar line of work and bet we've worked in some of the same places.[/size]
[/quote]

1) I have actually listened to Rush Limbaugh. He is a bigot, a racist, and he's a complete whore who intentionally spreads hatred, prejudice and division in order to line his own pockets.
2) It took FEMA 5 full days to get the first gallon of drinking water into New Orleans. Meanwhile Condelisa Rice went shopping in NYC. We got the first American flight into Haiti in the first day - you need to check your facts. Delays thereafter were due to the fact that the runway was damaged but the aid was still there waiting.
3) Been to Haiti personally? I have and so have others in this forum. Nobody here has said at any point there was some conservative evil plot. Most expressed compassion for Haiti. You on the other hand use it as an excuse to attack politics - which in my opinion kinda puts you on a par with Rush Limbaugh. .
[u][b]4) Been to New Orleans? I've got family there and in Baton Rouge. The levys have always been maintained by the US Corp of Engineers as they continue to this day[/b][/u]. Katrina simply overwhelmed and swamped them.
5) Pat Robertson claims to represent the religious right wing of the conservatives. Most give him at least lip service. Giving even a hint of respect to someone who would go on national television in the face of great human tragedy and claim it's due to a pact with the devil qualifies as a grade A lunatic by any stretch of the imagination.

6) You remind me of this 20 year old kid I used to work with. He spouted the conservative/republican agenda pretty well too. Mostly we sat around and laughed at him because quite frankly the world and politics just aren't that simple. Both sides have a lot to answer for. You can't blame everything on a past president and you can't blame everything on a current one though obviously you're going to try. Bush made horrendous mistakes - the most major being that because he refused to accept his own fallibility once he started down a bad path he refused to listen to anyone telling him to back off. So he just dug the country deeper and deeper. Obama (whom I openly support) has a lot of mess to clean up. Only time is going to tell whether or not he's up to the task. The conservative Republican movement should at least give him some credit for trying - but no. They'd rather sit around and support throwing up roadblocks instead of having a part in constructive change. Libertarians are so busy listening to their own rhetoric they haven't done a damn thing for the country except charge for admission to their party. At least neither Republicans nor Democrats have sunk that low. Get back to me when they actually do something. Then I'll take them seriously instead of just one more flag waiving corporation collecting money while masquerading as a political movement.

'Rani
[/quote]

You need to learn some facts before making such completely wrong statements.
Unless, of course, you are more informed than the American Society of Civil Engineers, or their testimony to congress. Even more, your statement is further proven uninformed by LA statutes.

http://www.asce.org/files/pdf/pressroom/hsgac12152005.pdf

"The levees are constructed by the federal government and are maintained by local interests,
except for government assistance as necessary during major floods. Periodic inspections of
maintenance are made by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and local levee and drainage
districts.
The Louisiana levee system has evolved over many generations, with projects being constructed
by the Corps of Engineers under local sponsorship. [u][b]Each parish (county) has a levee district, a
political subdivision of the state “organized for the purpose [,] and charged with the duty [,] of
constructing and maintaining levees, … .” LA. REV. STAT. ANN. § 281 (WEST 2005). Acting
under state law, many local jurisdictions in Louisiana have constructed their own levees outside
the federal framework."[/b][/u]

What the hell does the Sec of State going shopping have to do with a huricane in New Orleans? THat is a completely politically motivated statement about two completely unrelated events. Typical of a lib, trying to stir-up a bunch of crap about someone who has nothing to do with the even at hand. Hint... Sec of States duties involve foreign policy-and LA is still part of the USA. http://www.state.gov/secretary/115194.htm Where does it say anything about dealing with domestic natural disasters, for crap-sakes.

[verio.]

I dunno if you guys have seen the stuff on MTV, about texting YELE to 501501, and they send $10 to Haiti. I've done it almost 4 times now, I really feel for them. I have a buddy who was sent over with the 82nd airborne and he just describes the suffering people are going through, it's heart wrenching. People walk 25+ miles and pay exorbitant amount for a gallon of water just so their family can have fluid for a day or two. It's truly a tragedy, and I hope only the best to come in the future for the people of Haiti

[thatonethere]

[quote name='verio.' date='02 February 2010 - 09:44 PM' timestamp='1265172290' post='449341']
I dunno if you guys have seen the stuff on MTV, about texting YELE to 501501, and they send $10 to Haiti. I've done it almost 4 times now, I really feel for them. I have a buddy who was sent over with the 82nd airborne and he just describes the suffering people are going through, it's heart wrenching. [b]People walk 25+ miles and pay exorbitant amount for a gallon of water just so their family can have fluid for a day or two.[/b] It's truly a tragedy, and I hope only the best to come in the future for the people of Haiti
[/quote]


That's horrible. Honestly, I wonder exactly how much money is going to go towards helping the people. From what I understand, the Hatian government is very corrupt. Who knows if they'll try to take their share of the funds.

[Rani]

[quote name='TheScotsman' date='02 February 2010 - 08:23 PM' timestamp='1265171021' post='449337']

You need to learn some facts before making such completely wrong statements.
Unless, of course, you are more informed than the American Society of Civil Engineers, or their testimony to congress. Even more, your statement is further proven uninformed by LA statutes.

[url="http://www.asce.org/files/pdf/pressroom/hsgac12152005.pdf"]http://www.asce.org/...gac12152005.pdf[/url]

"The levees are constructed by the federal government and are maintained by local interests,
except for government assistance as necessary during major floods. Periodic inspections of
maintenance are made by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and local levee and drainage
districts.
The Louisiana levee system has evolved over many generations, with projects being constructed
by the Corps of Engineers under local sponsorship. [u][b]Each parish (county) has a levee district, a
political subdivision of the state "organized for the purpose [,] and charged with the duty [,] of
constructing and maintaining levees, … ." LA. REV. STAT. ANN. § 281 (WEST 2005). Acting
under state law, many local jurisdictions in Louisiana have constructed their own levees outside
the federal framework."[/b][/u]

What the hell does the Sec of State going shopping have to do with a huricane in New Orleans? THat is a completely politically motivated statement about two completely unrelated events. Typical of a lib, trying to stir-up a bunch of crap about someone who has nothing to do with the even at hand. Hint... Sec of States duties involve foreign policy-and LA is still part of the USA. [url="http://www.state.gov/secretary/115194.htm"]http://www.state.gov...tary/115194.htm[/url] Where does it say anything about dealing with domestic natural disasters, for crap-sakes.
[/quote]

Scotsman you are not that dumb. I know for a fact from previous conversations you are not remotely that dumb. I can't actually be mad at you though because technically we're both right. While the City of New Orleans and State of Louisiana do have legal responsibility for maintenance they've contracted it back to the Corps of Engineers for decades because the Corps is better equipped to handle it, not to mention cheaper and a convenient way to offset liability back to the Federal Government. They're far from the only municipality to do so. In California alone, the City of Palm Springs contracts them to handle the drainage channels surrounding the City; and Long Beach contracts them to maintain the major portions of the Harbor. The City of Los Angeles uses them in consulting capacity for the Los Angeles river channel and I believe the City of San Diego once had them take on the responsibility for maintenance of the harbor - though I have no idea if they're still involved in any way considering San Diego is large enough and prosperous enough to handle it themselves.

As far as Rice is concerned, while it's true that the Secretary of State is primarily concerned with foreign affairs, in reality that has become so by recent tradition not by any official job description. The Secretary of State serves at the direction and pleasure of the President - period. They can be sent to oversee the clean up of a domestic garbage dump if the President so chooses. As 4th in line of succession and a valuable member of the cabinet to have left Washington and brazenly and publicly gone shopping after notification of the crises speaks of unbelievably poor judgement at best. Kissinger, Christopher, Albright or Powell certainly wouldn't have done it. Neither would Hilary for that matter although God knows she's guilty of plenty of bad judgement now and then herself.

You know all this and I know you know it. Quit defending the puppy. You're the voice of reason by comparison.

'Rani

[TheScotsman]

[quote name='Rani' date='03 February 2010 - 10:53 AM' timestamp='1265216017' post='449490']
[quote name='TheScotsman' date='02 February 2010 - 08:23 PM' timestamp='1265171021' post='449337']
You need to learn some facts before making such completely wrong statements.
Unless, of course, you are more informed than the American Society of Civil Engineers, or their testimony to congress. Even more, your statement is further proven uninformed by LA statutes.

[url="http://www.asce.org/files/pdf/pressroom/hsgac12152005.pdf"]http://www.asce.org/...gac12152005.pdf[/url]

"The levees are constructed by the federal government and are maintained by local interests,
except for government assistance as necessary during major floods. Periodic inspections of
maintenance are made by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and local levee and drainage
districts.
The Louisiana levee system has evolved over many generations, with projects being constructed
by the Corps of Engineers under local sponsorship. [u][b]Each parish (county) has a levee district, a
political subdivision of the state "organized for the purpose [,] and charged with the duty [,] of
constructing and maintaining levees, … ." LA. REV. STAT. ANN. § 281 (WEST 2005). Acting
under state law, many local jurisdictions in Louisiana have constructed their own levees outside
the federal framework."[/b][/u]

What the hell does the Sec of State going shopping have to do with a huricane in New Orleans? THat is a completely politically motivated statement about two completely unrelated events. Typical of a lib, trying to stir-up a bunch of crap about someone who has nothing to do with the even at hand. Hint... Sec of States duties involve foreign policy-and LA is still part of the USA. [url="http://www.state.gov/secretary/115194.htm"]http://www.state.gov...tary/115194.htm[/url] Where does it say anything about dealing with domestic natural disasters, for crap-sakes.
[/quote]

Scotsman you are not that dumb. I know for a fact from previous conversations you are not remotely that dumb. I can't actually be mad at you though because technically we're both right. While the City of New Orleans and State of Louisiana do have legal responsibility for maintenance they've contracted it back to the Corps of Engineers for decades because the Corps is better equipped to handle it, not to mention cheaper and a convenient way to offset liability back to the Federal Government. They're far from the only municipality to do so. In California alone, the City of Palm Springs contracts them to handle the drainage channels surrounding the City; and Long Beach contracts them to maintain the major portions of the Harbor. The City of Los Angeles uses them in consulting capacity for the Los Angeles river channel and I believe the City of San Diego once had them take on the responsibility for maintenance of the harbor - though I have no idea if they're still involved in any way considering San Diego is large enough and prosperous enough to handle it themselves.

As far as Rice is concerned, while it's true that the Secretary of State is primarily concerned with foreign affairs, in reality that has become so by recent tradition not by any official job description. The Secretary of State serves at the direction and pleasure of the President - period. They can be sent to oversee the clean up of a domestic garbage dump if the President so chooses. As 4th in line of succession and a valuable member of the cabinet to have left Washington and brazenly and publicly gone shopping after notification of the crises speaks of unbelievably poor judgement at best. Kissinger, Christopher, Albright or Powell certainly wouldn't have done it. Neither would Hilary for that matter although God knows she's guilty of plenty of bad judgement now and then herself.

You know all this and I know you know it. Quit defending the puppy. You're the voice of reason by comparison.

'Rani
[/quote]

Now it's G*d's fault, eh?

[verio.]

[quote name='thatonethere' date='03 February 2010 - 05:13 AM' timestamp='1265192023' post='449427']
[quote name='verio.' date='02 February 2010 - 09:44 PM' timestamp='1265172290' post='449341']
I dunno if you guys have seen the stuff on MTV, about texting YELE to 501501, and they send $10 to Haiti. I've done it almost 4 times now, I really feel for them. I have a buddy who was sent over with the 82nd airborne and he just describes the suffering people are going through, it's heart wrenching. [b]People walk 25+ miles and pay exorbitant amount for a gallon of water just so their family can have fluid for a day or two.[/b] It's truly a tragedy, and I hope only the best to come in the future for the people of Haiti
[/quote]


That's horrible. Honestly, I wonder exactly how much money is going to go towards helping the people. From what I understand, the Hatian government is very corrupt. Who knows if they'll try to take their share of the funds.
[/quote]

I wondered the same thing too before I sent money to them, but even if the people are getting half of what I spend I am happy, any little money right now can help them, even if it's in the smallest of ways