Some Restriction Better Than Unrestricted Flow?

[Majid]

I always thought, and felt during use, that a little restriction in your draw performs better and now today it seems to be confirmed. Just bought a new hose, no leaks and draws like breathing. Strange thing is it doesn't smoke as well as my older slightly restricted and even slightly leaking hose i used the last couple months. Setup is exactly the same, same tobacco, coals, pipe, bowl and packing. Am i a little paranoid, is it just chance or is there something to it? I don't really figure the physics behind better smoke from restricted draw. Maybe the extra pressure makes it heat up better?
First i smoked with my new hose, full bowl and it smoked less, then i smoked half a bowl with the new hose and the second half the old one and i noticed denser and more flavourfull clouds. Edited February 3, 2010 by Majid

[twoapplesplease]

agree....

[Amn_sinclair]

i was actually having this problem the other night... i switcheed from narbish hose to my mya just cause i was getting a funny flavor out of the narbish and it felt like my clouds were better when i went back to the mya hose

[rhineholt]

dammit!!! why did I buy a nammor then?!
maybe that's why i don't get super duper flavor out of tangiers!!!

[ih303]

I thought about the same thing the other day after I swapped my Razan for a KM Leather hose that had an almost effortless pull. However, it felt like I was getting a little less smoke.

It all comes down to ratios. To hit the sweet spot these ratios have to be right. One of these is a basic ratio common to combustion in general - heat:oxygen:fuel. We manipulate this ratio by varying 1) The amount of coal used (heat), 2) The type, pack, and amount of tobacco used (fuel), and 3) The amount of water in the base and the interior diameter of the hookah's "plumbing" and hose (oxygen). Since these variables are interrelated, if there is a change in one variable, the other two must be adjusted to continue hitting the sweet spot.

That being said, I realized that with my leather hose increasing the amount of O2 in my mix, I needed to either increase the amount of heat or get a bigger bowl. Well, I didn't have a bigger bowl so I added more heat. It was definately better. Edited February 3, 2010 by ih303

[mushrat]

Well, Ih said what i was going to.

That being said however I still get the best hits off my big bore hoses. Including my custom Moose hose.

[mattarios2]

I think it's preference. I prefer a bigger bore hose, and find I get bigger hits off of it over mya hoses and smaller bore hoses.

But I do have friends who prefer smaller diameter hoses. I think it depends on how you inhale ... your style if you will.

I think heat plays a role too. If you just barely have enough heat, and you use a bigger bore hose, it pulls the heat harder over the tobacco, leaving you with not a lot of smoke production. But if you use a smaller bore hose, less air is able to travel over the tobacco, giving it more time to produce heat = more smoke.

Maybe try more heat? Just a belief i've had ... because when I started using bigger bore hoses, I noticed I needed more heat.

[Chaz1337]

Thats why I <3 my Nammor. Its a very happy medium between the hoses with to much flow and the Mya hoses that are a little to restrictive.

[Stuie]

I am going to go with preference.

I like a little restriction at times. I use my nammors, all the time.

My buddy loves a little restriction on his smoke. He loves Mya Hoses.

[Majid]

Thanks for the insight guys. IH303, thanks, makes a lot of sense. I think i'll try smaller holes and pack a little tighter to compensate, kind of defeats the purpose of my new hose though Did notice the volume of smoke is probably somewhat smaller but it was also mixed with a greater volume of air, i breathe out less smoke for longer rather than concentrated cloudage. Increasing heat can help but too much and you burn your shisha.

[LZ22]

I love my nammor. I do have to take larger inhales to get big clouds, but I don't mind. With the small Mya hoses, I would get light headed from trying to take big draws because it was too restricted. I feel much more comfortable and natural drawing from a nammor. Also, it just feels and looks a million times better. A Mya hose looks a bit ridiculous hooked up to a large pipe!

[ih303]

[quote name='Majid' date='03 February 2010 - 11:19 AM' timestamp='1265221181' post='449501']
Thanks for the insight guys. IH303, thanks, makes a lot of sense. I think i'll try smaller holes and pack a little tighter to compensate, kind of defeats the purpose of my new hose though [img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif[/img] Did notice the volume of smoke is probably somewhat smaller but it was also mixed with a greater volume of air, i breathe out less smoke for longer rather than concentrated cloudage. Increasing heat can help but too much and you burn your shisha.
[/quote]

One other thought on this. It may be the case that the only difference between hoses with different internal diameters is the amount of work required to move air through them. For me, when I smoke out of a Mya hose, I have to pull exceptionally hard to get good smoke. With Razans, it takes much less effort to obtain the same results. Even moreso with my leather hose. Think of it in terms of straws. How much work would it require to pull the same amount of Diet Dr Pepper from from a glass with a coffee stirrer straw vs. jumbo straw from McDonalds?

I think it's fair to assume that we're all after epic clouds. This means we're willing to do the work necessary to get those clouds. That would lead me to believe that the amount of heat and air we move through the bowl is constant whereas the amount of work required to move the heated air is dependent on the gear and/or setup.

On a side note, one thing that really annoys me about a lot of premium hoses is the fact that while the actual hose may be quite big, the openings on both ends are significantly smaller. It seems like this completely defeats the point of having a larger diamerter hose to begin with. I've never tried, but I'd be curious to see how one of these hoses would perform with both ends bored out. Hmm... new project?

This is pretty interesting. I dig these kind of discussions.

[Universal Magnetic]

[quote name='mattarios2' date='03 February 2010 - 11:15 AM' timestamp='1265213753' post='449485']
I think it's preference. I prefer a bigger bore hose, and find I get bigger hits off of it over mya hoses and smaller bore hoses.

But I do have friends who prefer smaller diameter hoses. I think it depends on how you inhale ... your style if you will.

I think heat plays a role too. If you just barely have enough heat, and you use a bigger bore hose, it pulls the heat harder over the tobacco, leaving you with not a lot of smoke production. But if you use a smaller bore hose, less air is able to travel over the tobacco, giving it more time to produce heat = more smoke.

Maybe try more heat? Just a belief i've had ... because when I started using bigger bore hoses, I noticed I needed more heat.
[/quote]
+1

[Amn_sinclair]

smoking my mya hose right now on mizo white grape with 3 bamboo coals. getting awesome clouds. i forgot how much i liked this hose

[nars2k]

[quote name='ih303' date='03 February 2010 - 12:07 PM' timestamp='1265227650' post='449524']
[quote name='Majid' date='03 February 2010 - 11:19 AM' timestamp='1265221181' post='449501']
Thanks for the insight guys. IH303, thanks, makes a lot of sense. I think i'll try smaller holes and pack a little tighter to compensate, kind of defeats the purpose of my new hose though [img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif[/img] Did notice the volume of smoke is probably somewhat smaller but it was also mixed with a greater volume of air, i breathe out less smoke for longer rather than concentrated cloudage. Increasing heat can help but too much and you burn your shisha.
[/quote]

One other thought on this. It may be the case that the only difference between hoses with different internal diameters is the amount of work required to move air through them. For me, when I smoke out of a Mya hose, I have to pull exceptionally hard to get good smoke. With Razans, it takes much less effort to obtain the same results. Even moreso with my leather hose. Think of it in terms of straws. How much work would it require to pull the same amount of Diet Dr Pepper from from a glass with a coffee stirrer straw vs. jumbo straw from McDonalds?

I think it's fair to assume that we're all after epic clouds. This means we're willing to do the work necessary to get those clouds. That would lead me to believe that the amount of heat and air we move through the bowl is constant whereas the amount of work required to move the heated air is dependent on the gear and/or setup.

On a side note, one thing that really annoys me about a lot of premium hoses is the fact that while the actual hose may be quite big, the openings on both ends are significantly smaller. It seems like this completely defeats the point of having a larger diamerter hose to begin with. I've never tried, but I'd be curious to see how one of these hoses would perform with both ends bored out. Hmm... new project?

This is pretty interesting. I dig these kind of discussions.
[/quote]

Yeah I feel the same way, I own a hose that has a larger gauge than even a KM hose yes the ends are as small as a MYA. I think I have a project on my hands as well.

[dizzbizz]

[quote name='nars2k' date='04 February 2010 - 12:03 AM' timestamp='1265267023' post='449632']
[quote name='ih303' date='03 February 2010 - 12:07 PM' timestamp='1265227650' post='449524']
[quote name='Majid' date='03 February 2010 - 11:19 AM' timestamp='1265221181' post='449501']
Thanks for the insight guys. IH303, thanks, makes a lot of sense. I think i'll try smaller holes and pack a little tighter to compensate, kind of defeats the purpose of my new hose though [img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif[/img] Did notice the volume of smoke is probably somewhat smaller but it was also mixed with a greater volume of air, i breathe out less smoke for longer rather than concentrated cloudage. Increasing heat can help but too much and you burn your shisha.
[/quote]

One other thought on this. It may be the case that the only difference between hoses with different internal diameters is the amount of work required to move air through them. For me, when I smoke out of a Mya hose, I have to pull exceptionally hard to get good smoke. With Razans, it takes much less effort to obtain the same results. Even moreso with my leather hose. Think of it in terms of straws. How much work would it require to pull the same amount of Diet Dr Pepper from from a glass with a coffee stirrer straw vs. jumbo straw from McDonalds?

I think it's fair to assume that we're all after epic clouds. This means we're willing to do the work necessary to get those clouds. That would lead me to believe that the amount of heat and air we move through the bowl is constant whereas the amount of work required to move the heated air is dependent on the gear and/or setup.

On a side note, one thing that really annoys me about a lot of premium hoses is the fact that while the actual hose may be quite big, the openings on both ends are significantly smaller. It seems like this completely defeats the point of having a larger diamerter hose to begin with. I've never tried, but I'd be curious to see how one of these hoses would perform with both ends bored out. Hmm... new project?

This is pretty interesting. I dig these kind of discussions.
[/quote]

Yeah I feel the same way, I own a hose that has a larger gauge than even a KM hose yes the ends are as small as a MYA. I think I have a project on my hands as well.
[/quote]

I've thought about this recently. Especially after that post of that old Persian hookah. The hose goes directly into the stem, and I've also seen older hookahs where the hose isn't a "hose", instead its just a pipe coming out of the base. I'm sure the pull on these is like breathing.

[MechEng]

IH303 think you have at least one set of hose ends to experiment on. If you do it let me know how it goes.

[Sonthert]

There's responsiveness to consider. Some easy draws aren't responsive...they're baggy. Like for instance, I had a Turkish hose...not very responsive. Baggy draw.

Syrian hookahs have tighter draws than Egyptian stuff...they certainly know how to make hookahs, its not a mistake...they think they smoke better. In a like sense, perhaps the transition from 30* hubs to 26* hubs in premium KMs is because they want the draws to be more responsive.