ih303 Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Before I get started, I will say flipping coals is not THAT big of a deal. But, that doesn't mean there's not a better way to do it. A while back, I created a thread about how I wanted to modify a toaster to heat coals evenly on both sides and then pop up when the coals were ready. Well, I never did it. But the dream is still alive! I'd like to tap into this well of knowledge that is the hookah forum and get thinking about another future hookah innovation - the dedicated coal starter. Here's my [url="http://www.shopperschoice.com/picviewer.html?image=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn.cloudfiles.mosso.com%2Fc128031%2Fsc-image%2Ff%2F6%2F2%2Fb%2Ff62bf78c23f2bf804c65cfa6ba444caa.jpg&itemid=2545018"]idea[/url] (Sized down, of course). So, to start. Hopefully, everybody is familiar with a typical [url="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/B000WEOQV8/ref=dp_image_0?ie=UTF8&n=286168&s=garden"]charcoal chimney[/url] used for grilling. These things are PHENOMENAL for lighting charcoal, they're just too big. This thing would start with a chimney of about 4" Diameter and 8" height with a nice, stand-off handle. The bottom would be set into the cylinder about 2" or so to allow for airflow. I was thinking gas would be better for starting a bunch of coals for lounge use specifically. I know electric is good but I can't really see it starting any more than a single layer of coals. The whole chimney portion of it would seperate from the heating element. The idea would be you would have several of these things prefilled with fresh coals, and when you need to go out for a coal run, you just grab the started chimney and throw a fresh one on the burner. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename067 Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 I can't think right now, lets consider this post a bump for other to chime in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Hmm, that's a pretty interesting idea. It would be cool to make one in a way that it's small enough for an every day coal lighter, not that flipping coals is that bad, but it would still be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuie Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 Very interesting. I will admit using telekinesis to excite the molecules to get them lit, has been giving me headaches lately. Can't wait to see what you come up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hookah hippie Posted February 22, 2010 Share Posted February 22, 2010 hmm...let me ponder this for awhile i might have an idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff_T Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 I know this is a ways off of your idea and might not be the most efficient thing, but a while back Scalli made some pretty unique coal lighting setups. I could only find 2 vids and didn't look back through the forum to find the threads about it, but you can get the gist of it from these. [url="http://www.youtube.com/user/scalliwagrx8#p/u/39/4zmIUDc1GXQ"]More indepth overview[/url] and [url="http://www.youtube.com/user/scalliwagrx8#p/u/40/cMMp_YU6IY8"]Scalli borealis[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A13lackFish Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 i like the concept, if it works lemme know id be more then happy to purchase one. As for now, im going to continue lighting it and sticking it behind a fan till the entire coal is bright red... always seems to work 100% efficiently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquidglass Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 I like your idea but allow me to try to give my spin on it, maybe it'll get your gears turning more than mine are. Everyone always thinks of coal burners as being entirely upright. What if, and this is an if, you used TWO heating elements powered by the same tank. With holes in each side to allow for more air flow. Then you could position them either one on top of the other like an = sign with a space in between. OR you could turn that same design sideways. Then you could have a small heating basket made of strong mesh steel (aka able to withstand the heat) Think a circle or square with about an inch of depth. - with one hinged side - and a handle that is padded for handling that comes out with a release mechanism made into it for the hinged side. They heat, you take the 'holder' from between the elements (half the time b/c they were heated from both sides) release the clasp via the mechanism then place on hookah with tongs. It would be more suited for personal smoking lighting up to 4 coals at a time, but something I just thought of so hopefully it'll help someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeepItSimple Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 [quote name='liquidglass' date='23 February 2010 - 12:42 AM' timestamp='1266914536' post='453074'] I like your idea but allow me to try to give my spin on it, maybe it'll get your gears turning more than mine are. Everyone always thinks of coal burners as being entirely upright. What if, and this is an if, you used TWO heating elements powered by the same tank. With holes in each side to allow for more air flow. Then you could position them either one on top of the other like an = sign with a space in between. OR you could turn that same design sideways. Then you could have a small heating basket made of strong mesh steel (aka able to withstand the heat) Think a circle or square with about an inch of depth. - with one hinged side - and a handle that is padded for handling that comes out with a release mechanism made into it for the hinged side. They heat, you take the 'holder' from between the elements (half the time b/c they were heated from both sides) release the clasp via the mechanism then place on hookah with tongs. It would be more suited for personal smoking lighting up to 4 coals at a time, but something I just thought of so hopefully it'll help someone. [/quote] I like that, now just make it and start selling! haha let me know, I wanna buy one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twoapplesplease Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 I'd like to see an electric one that has a bottom and top heating element that is basically designed to work like a mini george forman grill,but much smaller and hotter of coarse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ih303 Posted February 23, 2010 Author Share Posted February 23, 2010 [quote name='liquidglass' date='23 February 2010 - 01:42 AM' timestamp='1266914536' post='453074'] I like your idea but allow me to try to give my spin on it, maybe it'll get your gears turning more than mine are. Everyone always thinks of coal burners as being entirely upright. What if, and this is an if, you used TWO heating elements powered by the same tank. With holes in each side to allow for more air flow. Then you could position them either one on top of the other like an = sign with a space in between. OR you could turn that same design sideways. Then you could have a small heating basket made of strong mesh steel (aka able to withstand the heat) Think a circle or square with about an inch of depth. - with one hinged side - and a handle that is padded for handling that comes out with a release mechanism made into it for the hinged side. They heat, you take the 'holder' from between the elements (half the time b/c they were heated from both sides) release the clasp via the mechanism then place on hookah with tongs. It would be more suited for personal smoking lighting up to 4 coals at a time, but something I just thought of so hopefully it'll help someone. [/quote] This kind of reminds me of my "charcoal toaster" idea. I'm still too afraid to actually try this. I think it would get too hot and melt the element. I think my idea is solid because it's so simple. The reason chimney's work so well is because they concentrate the heat. And the problem with concentrating heat on an electric heating element is that it would probably melt. We already have issues with our coil burners at the lounge crapping out after the internal wires/connectors melt due to heavy use. We replace our burners about twice a month. I think gas would be the best bet. I think with gas, you wouldn't have the issue with smoky coals that you sometimes have with electric starting. Plus, the flames would allow the starting of multiple layers of coals rather than just one. And I was thinking it would be fairly easy to make chimney's in different sizes for different uses, i.e. shorter size for home-use. Does anyone on the forum have access to a metal working shop? I'm wracking my brain trying to figure out how I can prototype this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joytron Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 Waffle Iron! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indian_villager Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 The thing with the chimney's is that i t relies on convection to force heat and o2 up the apparatus and start the other coals.....there needs to be sufficient coals for the thing to work. I have stated my solution many times before and I'll say it again. Bernz-o-matic TS 4000. Best blow torch I've used, coconaras are ablaze after a minute, and it gets the plumbing done quick as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSU Smoker Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 yeah we have a blow torch in my buddies garage...not the safest way to light coals but it lights em like a champ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOE Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 i just put a soup can over my coals on the coil. no flippage needed. very fast light up time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryno Posted February 23, 2010 Share Posted February 23, 2010 [quote name='JOE' date='23 February 2010 - 06:26 PM' timestamp='1266967600' post='453249'] i just put a soup can over my coals on the coil. no flippage needed. very fast light up time [/quote] You need to be careful doing that as you can easily overheat the burner and can cause bad things to happen like fires Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sariél Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 use this: (windcover from hookah john) [img]http://www.hookahjohn.com/images/wind%20cover%20silver.jpg[/img] put a removable metal screen in about 2" from the bottom, and cut a hole in the side for a torch. Done deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ih303 Posted February 24, 2010 Author Share Posted February 24, 2010 [quote name='indian_villager' date='23 February 2010 - 10:21 AM' timestamp='1266945680' post='453120'] The thing with the chimney's is that i t relies on convection to force heat and o2 up the apparatus and start the other coals.....there needs to be sufficient coals for the thing to work.[/quote] Good point. Keep in mind, I'm going into this with lounge use in mind but would like it to be versatile enough to be used at home. Ok, so what do we know? We know that electric coils have to make contact with the coals in order to start them limiting the number of coals that can be started to the size of the surface area of the element. Flame works well but would not be as effective on small numbers of coals. However, if the chimney was small enough, i.e. 3" diameter, it would be fine. Man, it'd be sweet to work out the fundamentals of this so I can start thinking about features. I'd like to see it automatic start upon detection of a chimney (no nobs or buttons), a timed shutoff feature with ready alarm, and ash catchers on the heating apparatus and chimney (not sure how I'd do that one yet). Anyway, let's keep the ideas flowing. The more we roll this around, the smoother it will get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoser Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 Or you could forget the coals entirely and use one of these. [img]http://image.ecplaza.com/offer/k/kelley555/5896002.jpg[/img][quote]The brand REN HEADSTREAM Electronic Shisha Charcoal No.RY0811 replaced the ignition of traditional Shisha Charcoal, which is the new high-tech R & D product, it is based on high thermal conductivity of ceramic, it has quick heating speed and temperature of 450-520℃.The temperature of the ceramic surface can reach 80-100℃. Specifications︰ Global First E-carbon For Hookah Electronic Shisha Charcoal 1.Item No.:RY0811 2. Product Specification:Dia.42X30mm Advantages︰ Electronic shisha charcoal characteristics: 1. It adopts new high-tech heat conduction technology, low-voltage DC power supply, overall high-density ceramic structure, stable performance, the heating temperature is the same as charcoal. 2. Smokeless, no toxic, odorless, no ash, no sparks and safety for human. 3. High efficiency and energy saving, environmental-protection, long time and low cost for use, beautiful shape and convenient transport. [b]Optional Information[/b] - HS Code : 8516 Electric Heaters; Other Electrothermic Appliances for Domestic Purpose - Payment : T/T - Delivery : Immediately - Origin : Shaoyang City - Minimum Order : 612 sets - Packaging : 1 set/inner box,36 boxes/carton - Inspection : CE - Samples : Charge - Sample Price : 28 USD - Remarks : Sale price is $9.90/set FOB Shenzhen on the base of MOQ 612 sets[/quote] The only catches are the shipping from China would probably be expensive, and you have to buy a minimum of 612 of them direct from the manufacturer (I haven't found a retailer online yet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chreees Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 [quote name='Hoser' date='24 February 2010 - 03:49 PM' timestamp='1267048189' post='453491'] 2. Smokeless, no toxic, odorless, no ash, no sparks and [b]safety for human. [/b] The only catches are the shipping from China would probably be expensive, and you have to buy a minimum of 612 of them direct from the manufacturer [b](I haven't found a retailer online yet)[/b]. [/quote] "safety for human".... Hahahaha Apparently someone sells them here stateside because there's a guy on youtube who reviewed it. They don't work as well compared to the real thing. If they did work well, I'd be all over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuie Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA There are some on eBay and NazarHookah had some. He put them at half price for a while and still couldn't move them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 [quote name='Jeff_T' date='23 February 2010 - 01:11 AM' timestamp='1266909117' post='453062'] I know this is a ways off of your idea and might not be the most efficient thing, but a while back Scalli made some pretty unique coal lighting setups. I could only find 2 vids and didn't look back through the forum to find the threads about it, but you can get the gist of it from these. [url="http://www.youtube.com/user/scalliwagrx8#p/u/39/4zmIUDc1GXQ"]More indepth overview[/url] and [url="http://www.youtube.com/user/scalliwagrx8#p/u/40/cMMp_YU6IY8"]Scalli borealis[/url] [/quote] Man i forgot about those, i miss scalli lol. the one he made from the heiniken keg was pretty awesome. And those ecoals pop up every now and then, i remember reading about them like 3 years ago. And yes, they are humorous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chreees Posted February 24, 2010 Share Posted February 24, 2010 [quote name='Stuie' date='24 February 2010 - 04:42 PM' timestamp='1267051340' post='453502'] HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA There are some on eBay and NazarHookah had some. He put them at half price for a while and still couldn't move them. [/quote] Not to mention I hear they suck especially on phunnel bowls.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 [quote name='INCUBUSRATM' date='24 February 2010 - 04:56 PM' timestamp='1267052211' post='453504'] [quote name='Stuie' date='24 February 2010 - 04:42 PM' timestamp='1267051340' post='453502'] HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA There are some on eBay and NazarHookah had some. He put them at half price for a while and still couldn't move them. [/quote] Not to mention I hear they suck especially on phunnel bowls.... [/quote] They suck on a cereal bowl.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ih303 Posted February 25, 2010 Author Share Posted February 25, 2010 I can't imagine electric heaters ever taking the place of actual coals. I actually thought about it before. The only way you could ever get it to work would be to have the heat source respond to air flowing through the bowl. For instance, if there was some sort of a pitot tube or propeller in the stem of the bowl sensititve enough to detect the velocity of the air flow, then control a heating element, increasing heat proportionate to air flow. Now, while this would clearly be too much effort to put into a bowl, perhaps it could be housed in a piece that fit in between the bowl and the hookah shank. Idk... just spinning my wheels here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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