Celibate

[acolorado]

So I have now been celibate for about 7 years. That would be more impressive if it were my choice but ... hehehe ... it is my choice - I just really like that joke.

In all seriousness about 7 years ago I decided that I would not sleep with anyone that I was not in a committed relationship with or didn't think things would work out with. I've had quite a few opportunities for casual sex or just dating sex but that's not what I've been looking for so I always turn it down.

Now I've gotten so used to living alone and not having that kind of relationship that I don't even enjoy dating anymore. There just seems like so much compromise and I'm not willing to do that anymore.

You might think that when you're celibate for this long you miss sex, but actually you get used to it and compared to all the hassles that a relationship usually entails it just doesn't seem worth it.

The lifestyle is really working for me, but I am curious if anyone else has tried long-term celibacy and what their experience has been like?

[Charley]

3 years but its not my choice. and that isnt a joke.

[delSol_si]

im still virgin, so ive been "celibate" for 24 years now, going on 25, by choice mostly.

[joytron]

so does jerking off count?

[Amn_sinclair]

[quote name='joytron' date='19 March 2010 - 06:46 AM' timestamp='1268977571' post='458146']
so does jerking off count?
[/quote]

i was wondering the same thing

[delSol_si]

[quote name='joytron' date='19 March 2010 - 12:46 AM' timestamp='1268977571' post='458146']
so does jerking off count?
[/quote]

oops, maybe im not celibate then... guess it depends on the perspective.

[SuburbanSmoker]

to truly be celibate u really arent supposed to relieve yourself in any way. that being said its not for everyone...myself included. props for being able to do it though. thats some dedication

[thecoalition]

i def give props - i could never do it. the longest i can go without trying to have it off with my gf is about a week. by then my body and mind turn everything into something sexual. my gf thinks im a closeted addict (j/k'ing?)

[acolorado]

I think in general only sex with another person counts.

The only people I have met who try that are religious nuts.... er... folks.

[Amn_sinclair]

yeah i give probs to anyone that can be celibate. i just went 17 days without any sex or jacking off i was losing my mind it just doesnt feel natural to me plus mentally i start going nuts lol but like i said props to peoplee that can do it

[Chreees]

There is no way I could do it... NO way, I tell you...

[wayfarinstranger]

[quote name='Amn_sinclair' date='19 March 2010 - 03:08 AM' timestamp='1268986090' post='458174']
[quote name='joytron' date='19 March 2010 - 06:46 AM' timestamp='1268977571' post='458146']
so does jerking off count?
[/quote]

i was wondering the same thing
[/quote]

Man I hope not, in that case I don't know if just about anyone that's breathing could say they've maintained celibacy...

I stayed a virgin until I was married about a year and a half ago. That was a conscious choice as I am a Christian and that falls in line with what I believe the Bible teaches. And frankly looking back I'm glad I did that because now I don't have a lot of memories of other girls I've been with to compare my wife to, and I know I probably would.

[Rani]

[quote name='wayfarinstranger' date='22 March 2010 - 07:06 PM' timestamp='1269313575' post='458951']
[quote name='Amn_sinclair' date='19 March 2010 - 03:08 AM' timestamp='1268986090' post='458174']
[quote name='joytron' date='19 March 2010 - 06:46 AM' timestamp='1268977571' post='458146']
so does jerking off count?
[/quote]

i was wondering the same thing
[/quote]

Man I hope not, in that case I don't know if just about anyone that's breathing could say they've maintained celibacy...

I stayed a virgin until I was married about a year and a half ago. That was a conscious choice as I am a Christian and that falls in line with what I believe the Bible teaches. And frankly looking back I'm glad I did that because now I don't have a lot of memories of other girls I've been with to compare my wife to, and I know I probably would.
[/quote]

I foresee a mid-life crisis and a swimsuit model 30 years into your future.......And although I'm really just teasing you, according to the statistics, those are exactly the people who end up have mid-life affairs or end up breaking up their marriages to experience single life. I believe neither in celibacy nor irresponsible behavior. Responsible sexuality is one of God's gifts to us.

'Rani

[wayfarinstranger]

[quote name='Rani' date='22 March 2010 - 10:28 PM' timestamp='1269314937' post='458963']
[quote name='wayfarinstranger' date='22 March 2010 - 07:06 PM' timestamp='1269313575' post='458951']
[quote name='Amn_sinclair' date='19 March 2010 - 03:08 AM' timestamp='1268986090' post='458174']
[quote name='joytron' date='19 March 2010 - 06:46 AM' timestamp='1268977571' post='458146']
so does jerking off count?
[/quote]

i was wondering the same thing
[/quote]

Man I hope not, in that case I don't know if just about anyone that's breathing could say they've maintained celibacy...

I stayed a virgin until I was married about a year and a half ago. That was a conscious choice as I am a Christian and that falls in line with what I believe the Bible teaches. And frankly looking back I'm glad I did that because now I don't have a lot of memories of other girls I've been with to compare my wife to, and I know I probably would.
[/quote]

I foresee a mid-life crisis and a swimsuit model 30 years into your future.......And although I'm really just teasing you, according to the statistics, those are exactly the people who end up have mid-life affairs or end up breaking up their marriages to experience single life. I believe neither in celibacy nor irresponsible behavior. Responsible sexuality is one of God's gifts to us.

'Rani
[/quote]

Hmm...That's fine I guess, but I think the crux of what you and I are talking about is who God is and His original intent for sex. If you say it's God's gift I think you need to qualify what you're basing that upon rather that what seems to be common sense. I believe the Bible states that sex is intended between a husband and wife (the why's could be discussed further). I'm not going around inflicting judgement on everyone who disagrees because that's just dumb and I don't like it when people do that to me, especially other Christians when we differ on something. But really, I know MANY dedicated Christian couples who are truly committed to each other that I look to as examples. And yes, statistics could be referred to that just as many Christians get divorced as non-Christians and I'm not going to justify that, because everyone's accountable for their own actions. But I'm saying it can be done and I don't have to go through 5-10 failed relationships to get there, and I'm all the better for it.

BTW, I find swimsuit models horribly plastic and cliche [img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/justkidding.gif[/img]

[Rani]

[quote name='wayfarinstranger' date='22 March 2010 - 07:56 PM' timestamp='1269316577' post='458972']
[quote name='Rani' date='22 March 2010 - 10:28 PM' timestamp='1269314937' post='458963']
[quote name='wayfarinstranger' date='22 March 2010 - 07:06 PM' timestamp='1269313575' post='458951']
[quote name='Amn_sinclair' date='19 March 2010 - 03:08 AM' timestamp='1268986090' post='458174']
[quote name='joytron' date='19 March 2010 - 06:46 AM' timestamp='1268977571' post='458146']
so does jerking off count?
[/quote]

i was wondering the same thing
[/quote]

Man I hope not, in that case I don't know if just about anyone that's breathing could say they've maintained celibacy...

I stayed a virgin until I was married about a year and a half ago. That was a conscious choice as I am a Christian and that falls in line with what I believe the Bible teaches. And frankly looking back I'm glad I did that because now I don't have a lot of memories of other girls I've been with to compare my wife to, and I know I probably would.
[/quote]

I foresee a mid-life crisis and a swimsuit model 30 years into your future.......And although I'm really just teasing you, according to the statistics, those are exactly the people who end up have mid-life affairs or end up breaking up their marriages to experience single life. I believe neither in celibacy nor irresponsible behavior. Responsible sexuality is one of God's gifts to us.

'Rani
[/quote]

Hmm...That's fine I guess, but I think the crux of what you and I are talking about is who God is and His original intent for sex. If you say it's God's gift I think you need to qualify what you're basing that upon rather that what seems to be common sense. I believe the Bible states that sex is intended between a husband and wife (the why's could be discussed further). I'm not going around inflicting judgement on everyone who disagrees because that's just dumb and I don't like it when people do that to me, especially other Christians when we differ on something. But really, I know MANY dedicated Christian couples who are truly committed to each other that I look to as examples. And yes, statistics could be referred to that just as many Christians get divorced as non-Christians and I'm not going to justify that, because everyone's accountable for their own actions. But I'm saying it can be done and I don't have to go through 5-10 failed relationships to get there, and I'm all the better for it.

BTW, I find swimsuit models horribly plastic and cliche [img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/justkidding.gif[/img]
[/quote]

As I said, I was teasing you. However, the Bible was originally written a couple-plus thousand years ago. Marriage as we understand it today didn't occur at all until about the 9th Century AD and wasn't really formalized until sometime around the 12th.

I don't think certification is the key factor. I believe that sex can be many things including a joining of souls. At the other side of the pendulum swing, it can also be a weapon inflicting our own pain on others. It's not just reproduction when it comes to the human race but a complex activity with societal and deeply personal impact. Someone should wait for marriage if that's what feels right to them. Someone should "indulge" if that's what feels right - however that assumes they act responsibly towards their partner as well as themselves. Morning after regrets for instance would indicate someone behaved irresponsibly the night before. Never do anything you have any reason to believe you're going to regret. And never let your own desires be given free reign to manipulate another. That's the best way I can explain it. Because every person you touch whether physically or emotionally you carry with you forever. So make certain you want that person inside your head before going there, you know?

'Rani

[Chreees]

Last I checked, the Bible was written by man, so how does man know what God really wants? I'm Christian and all that, but I don't believe the Bible is the direct word of God. There is a God, I believe, because how else would everything exist as it does? I don't follow any certain denomination because I've found way too much hypocrisy in each one I've tried. I believe doing the right thing will get you into the right place in the afterlife. Basically I follow the good 'ol rule of karma, while also believing in God. So... have sex if you want, I think, as long as it won't end up hurting anybody... Like, if you're a guy don't have sex with a girl if you don't feel right about it. Also make sure it's what she wants as well. If any doubt, don't do it. Same for the ladies... Basically follow your own moral code and stick to yourself, and don't let yourself down. My girlfriend and I have been together for four years now. We first had sex at age 15 (Well, she was 16). We both felt right about it, and have no regrets. We've always been safe and never took any chances. As long as you're responsible and feel it's right, I think it's okay to go ahead and do it before marriage. I also believe you should live with/have some physical interaction with a person before you marry them. What if there's just no chemistry in bed and you get married without fooling around first? Gonna leave both of you feeling very uneasy in bed with each other... Or you'll just end up lying to each other about "how it was."

[Rani]

[quote name='INCUBUSRATM' date='22 March 2010 - 09:49 PM' timestamp='1269323345' post='458999']
Last I checked, the Bible was written by man, so how does man know what God really wants? I'm Christian and all that, but I don't believe the Bible is the direct word of God. There is a God, I believe, because how else would everything exist as it does? I don't follow any certain denomination because I've found way too much hypocrisy in each one I've tried. I believe doing the right thing will get you into the right place in the afterlife. Basically I follow the good 'ol rule of karma, while also believing in God. So... have sex if you want, I think, as long as it won't end up hurting anybody... Like, if you're a guy don't have sex with a girl if you don't feel right about it. Also make sure it's what she wants as well. If any doubt, don't do it. Same for the ladies... Basically follow your own moral code and stick to yourself, and don't let yourself down. My girlfriend and I have been together for four years now. We first had sex at age 15 (Well, she was 16). We both felt right about it, and have no regrets. We've always been safe and never took any chances. As long as you're responsible and feel it's right, I think it's okay to go ahead and do it before marriage. I also believe you should live with/have some physical interaction with a person before you marry them. What if there's just no chemistry in bed and you get married without fooling around first? Gonna leave both of you feeling very uneasy in bed with each other... Or you'll just end up lying to each other about "how it was."


[/quote]

I absolutely agree with you. What's more....... I've been speaking the abstract. As for me personally, I'd never live with someone I hadn't slept with for at least several months. And I would never marry someone I hadn't lived with for at least a year. I've been married. So I happen to know the more burners you're cooking with, the better the meal is.


'Rani

[Chreees]

Totally agree with ya Rani... Better to do that than not and have to go through the whole hassle called divorce... I'd say your chances of divorce are less likely if you sleep with one another and live with each other first before marriage.

[thecoalition]

rani is truly the (insert favorite philosopher here) of the forum

[Rani]

[quote name='thecoalition' date='23 March 2010 - 11:08 AM' timestamp='1269371283' post='459058']
rani is truly the (insert favorite philosopher here) of the forum
[/quote]

Ye Gods no! That's way more responsibility than I ever want. I'm just a mouthy dame who's learned a few things the hard way and can't shut up about them. But thanks for the compliment.

[img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/whistling.gif[/img]



'Rani

[wayfarinstranger]

[quote name='Rani' date='23 March 2010 - 01:15 AM' timestamp='1269324942' post='459003']
[quote name='INCUBUSRATM' date='22 March 2010 - 09:49 PM' timestamp='1269323345' post='458999']
Last I checked, the Bible was written by man, so how does man know what God really wants? I'm Christian and all that, but I don't believe the Bible is the direct word of God. There is a God, I believe, because how else would everything exist as it does? I don't follow any certain denomination because I've found way too much hypocrisy in each one I've tried. I believe doing the right thing will get you into the right place in the afterlife. Basically I follow the good 'ol rule of karma, while also believing in God. So... have sex if you want, I think, as long as it won't end up hurting anybody... Like, if you're a guy don't have sex with a girl if you don't feel right about it. Also make sure it's what she wants as well. If any doubt, don't do it. Same for the ladies... Basically follow your own moral code and stick to yourself, and don't let yourself down. My girlfriend and I have been together for four years now. We first had sex at age 15 (Well, she was 16). We both felt right about it, and have no regrets. We've always been safe and never took any chances. As long as you're responsible and feel it's right, I think it's okay to go ahead and do it before marriage. I also believe you should live with/have some physical interaction with a person before you marry them. What if there's just no chemistry in bed and you get married without fooling around first? Gonna leave both of you feeling very uneasy in bed with each other... Or you'll just end up lying to each other about "how it was."

[img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/twocents.gif[/img]
[/quote]

I absolutely agree with you. What's more....... I've been speaking the abstract. As for me personally, I'd never live with someone I hadn't slept with for at least several months. And I would never marry someone I hadn't lived with for at least a year. I've been married. So I happen to know the more burners you're cooking with, the better the meal is.


'Rani
[/quote]

I haven't been able to comment yet since I've been at work all day, but I'll try and add something in a few hours.

[wayfarinstranger]

[quote name='Rani' date='23 March 2010 - 01:15 AM' timestamp='1269324942' post='459003']
[quote name='INCUBUSRATM' date='22 March 2010 - 09:49 PM' timestamp='1269323345' post='458999']
Last I checked, the Bible was written by man, so how does man know what God really wants? I'm Christian and all that, but I don't believe the Bible is the direct word of God. There is a God, I believe, because how else would everything exist as it does? I don't follow any certain denomination because I've found way too much hypocrisy in each one I've tried. I believe doing the right thing will get you into the right place in the afterlife. Basically I follow the good 'ol rule of karma, while also believing in God. So... have sex if you want, I think, as long as it won't end up hurting anybody... Like, if you're a guy don't have sex with a girl if you don't feel right about it. Also make sure it's what she wants as well. If any doubt, don't do it. Same for the ladies... Basically follow your own moral code and stick to yourself, and don't let yourself down. My girlfriend and I have been together for four years now. We first had sex at age 15 (Well, she was 16). We both felt right about it, and have no regrets. We've always been safe and never took any chances. As long as you're responsible and feel it's right, I think it's okay to go ahead and do it before marriage. I also believe you should live with/have some physical interaction with a person before you marry them. What if there's just no chemistry in bed and you get married without fooling around first? Gonna leave both of you feeling very uneasy in bed with each other... Or you'll just end up lying to each other about "how it was."

[img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/twocents.gif[/img]
[/quote]

I absolutely agree with you. What's more....... I've been speaking the abstract. As for me personally, I'd never live with someone I hadn't slept with for at least several months. And I would never marry someone I hadn't lived with for at least a year. I've been married. So I happen to know the more burners you're cooking with, the better the meal is.


'Rani
[/quote]

I've heard the argument before that the Bible was written two thousand years ago, thus implying that it's irrelevant for modern times. So what if it was written in ancient times, or written 100 years ago, or written now? Even if it was written now in this cultural backdrop, there will be people two thousand years from now that will say the same thing. The point is that many Christians believe that the Bible is God's actual teaching for humanity that applies to all cultures at all times. The Bible must transcend the cultural framework in which it was written. If not, then the only people that should have bothered adhering to it were those alive around the time the books were written. And the same could be said for any sacred text of other religions as well. While to a degree that man "wrote" the Bible, a more accurate statement would be that that God used people at various points in history to communicate His purpose. There is no other book EVER that has been written by so many different people over such a length of time that maintains the same message throughout.

In terms of marriage as we know it, the Bible references marriage as a monogamous, committed relationship between a man and woman quite clearly (and my point here isn't to argue the validity of heterosexual relationships vs. homosexual...That's a whole other can of worms that's probably not worth getting into). Marriage is referenced as far back as Noah's time, which I believe pre-dates the first human author of any of the Old Testament books.

One thing I have to ask you, INCUBUSRATM, is that you're a Christian. Yet you don't believe that the Bible is God's word. You say you believe there is a God, yet you don't hold to the Christian Bible, so what is your belief based upon? Many religions hold to belief in a Deity. Why Christianity? How do we know if God exists or what He is like? Furthermore, how can we know if our ethical system aligns with His so we know that we're doing the right thing?

I'm all about sexual chemistry between two people. My wife and I wouldn't be together if we didn't want each other. I've been interested in several really awesome girls (before I met my wife) but yet I couldn't bring myself to try and date them because the attraction factor wasn't really there. That wasn't the case when my wife came along.

What I'm inferring from what you guys are saying is that one should ascribe to a personal ethic, a moral code that one has to figure out for themselves. For some it's marriage, for others it's not. I believe Christianity is based upon the truth found in the Bible and that informs me how to live life. It's an objective truth that applies to everyone. God commands in the Bible to abstain from sex until marriage. That is my charge, and amazingly, somehow, I waited until marriage. And I'm glad I did, because, like you said Rani, sex is God's gift to us. Yet it's something that He intends within the confines of a married couple. Sex is not a primary need that governs whether or not I choose to be with somebody, whether or not they'll meet that need. Marriage, as you know, is a commitment, and my wife and I can learn how to please each other. We're not perfect at it, but we're committed and we're getting there. Sex is not a make-or-break thing for us, and I think to make it that is putting the cart before the horse.

I'm a harmonious fellow, pretty live-and-let-live, so it's rare that I'm in the place that I'm laying out all that I am here. We could be friends and what I've said here could possibly never come up, so please don't think I'm heavy-handedly espousing my beliefs and condemning all who disagree. I don't expect that those who don't hold to what the Bible teaches to follow it, because I don't think they get it. I wouldn't want to be forced to believe anything. But regardless, it's my stance. I respect yall's opinions, I just ask you to respect mine. We can talk about it further, and I'm happy to because I find this interesting, but this seems like a "agree to disagree" kind of topic.

[Rani]

[quote name='wayfarinstranger' date='23 March 2010 - 07:42 PM' timestamp='1269402133' post='459196']
[quote name='Rani' date='23 March 2010 - 01:15 AM' timestamp='1269324942' post='459003']
[quote name='INCUBUSRATM' date='22 March 2010 - 09:49 PM' timestamp='1269323345' post='458999']
Last I checked, the Bible was written by man, so how does man know what God really wants? I'm Christian and all that, but I don't believe the Bible is the direct word of God. There is a God, I believe, because how else would everything exist as it does? I don't follow any certain denomination because I've found way too much hypocrisy in each one I've tried. I believe doing the right thing will get you into the right place in the afterlife. Basically I follow the good 'ol rule of karma, while also believing in God. So... have sex if you want, I think, as long as it won't end up hurting anybody... Like, if you're a guy don't have sex with a girl if you don't feel right about it. Also make sure it's what she wants as well. If any doubt, don't do it. Same for the ladies... Basically follow your own moral code and stick to yourself, and don't let yourself down. My girlfriend and I have been together for four years now. We first had sex at age 15 (Well, she was 16). We both felt right about it, and have no regrets. We've always been safe and never took any chances. As long as you're responsible and feel it's right, I think it's okay to go ahead and do it before marriage. I also believe you should live with/have some physical interaction with a person before you marry them. What if there's just no chemistry in bed and you get married without fooling around first? Gonna leave both of you feeling very uneasy in bed with each other... Or you'll just end up lying to each other about "how it was."

[img]http://www.hookahforum.com/public/style_emoticons/default/twocents.gif[/img]
[/quote]

I absolutely agree with you. What's more....... I've been speaking the abstract. As for me personally, I'd never live with someone I hadn't slept with for at least several months. And I would never marry someone I hadn't lived with for at least a year. I've been married. So I happen to know the more burners you're cooking with, the better the meal is.


'Rani
[/quote]

I've heard the argument before that the Bible was written two thousand years ago, thus implying that it's irrelevant for modern times. So what if it was written in ancient times, or written 100 years ago, or written now? Even if it was written now in this cultural backdrop, there will be people two thousand years from now that will say the same thing. The point is that many Christians believe that the Bible is God's actual teaching for humanity that applies to all cultures at all times. The Bible must transcend the cultural framework in which it was written. If not, then the only people that should have bothered adhering to it were those alive around the time the books were written. And the same could be said for any sacred text of other religions as well. While to a degree that man "wrote" the Bible, a more accurate statement would be that that God used people at various points in history to communicate His purpose. There is no other book EVER that has been written by so many different people over such a length of time that maintains the same message throughout.

In terms of marriage as we know it, the Bible references marriage as a monogamous, committed relationship between a man and woman quite clearly (and my point here isn't to argue the validity of heterosexual relationships vs. homosexual...That's a whole other can of worms that's probably not worth getting into). Marriage is referenced as far back as Noah's time, which I believe pre-dates the first human author of any of the Old Testament books.

One thing I have to ask you, INCUBUSRATM, is that you're a Christian. Yet you don't believe that the Bible is God's word. You say you believe there is a God, yet you don't hold to the Christian Bible, so what is your belief based upon? Many religions hold to belief in a Deity. Why Christianity? How do we know if God exists or what He is like? Furthermore, how can we know if our ethical system aligns with His so we know that we're doing the right thing?

I'm all about sexual chemistry between two people. My wife and I wouldn't be together if we didn't want each other. I've been interested in several really awesome girls (before I met my wife) but yet I couldn't bring myself to try and date them because the attraction factor wasn't really there. That wasn't the case when my wife came along.

What I'm inferring from what you guys are saying is that one should ascribe to a personal ethic, a moral code that one has to figure out for themselves. For some it's marriage, for others it's not. I believe Christianity is based upon the truth found in the Bible and that informs me how to live life. It's an objective truth that applies to everyone. God commands in the Bible to abstain from sex until marriage. That is my charge, and amazingly, somehow, I waited until marriage. And I'm glad I did, because, like you said Rani, sex is God's gift to us. Yet it's something that He intends within the confines of a married couple. Sex is not a primary need that governs whether or not I choose to be with somebody, whether or not they'll meet that need. Marriage, as you know, is a commitment, and my wife and I can learn how to please each other. We're not perfect at it, but we're committed and we're getting there. Sex is not a make-or-break thing for us, and I think to make it that is putting the cart before the horse.

I'm a harmonious fellow, pretty live-and-let-live, so it's rare that I'm in the place that I'm laying out all that I am here. We could be friends and what I've said here could possibly never come up, so please don't think I'm heavy-handedly espousing my beliefs and condemning all who disagree. I don't expect that those who don't hold to what the Bible teaches to follow it, because I don't think they get it. I wouldn't want to be forced to believe anything. But regardless, it's my stance. I respect yall's opinions, I just ask you to respect mine. We can talk about it further, and I'm happy to because I find this interesting, but this seems like a "agree to disagree" kind of topic.
[/quote]

I don't think you're heavy handed. I believe what you think feels right and works for you.

I never said the Bible is irrelevant and I do take exception to your implication that those who don't accept it as directly from God's mouth do so. Even if you accept the validity of the Bible, it is still the work of men. The only actual words directly accredited to God are the Ten Commandments. Everything is is through the writings of disciples, etc.

I would suggest that it is the height of arrogance to presume to know the mind of God. Most organized religion is exactly that: Organized. You have absolutely no way of knowing that what you believe is in line with the intent and mind of God. You can assume it, you can follow what you're taught, you can go with what you believe to be right, and you can hope your interpretation is correct but you cannot truly know the mind of God. To imply this person or that person is living against God's wishes while you by keeping to your beliefs are living within God's grace is unbelievably separative and damaging. It sets up the "them" and "us" mentality that caused so much pain to humanity. And I said this speaking as an Ordained Clergy Person with a masters in Theology. (Which I bring up simply to stop any potential I'm Christian so you don't understand argument.)

My belief is that everyone live their lives in a way that fits their personal morality and upbringing. Do what works for you while harming no one else in the process. Because my belief is that if God wants us to do anything, it's that we spread love, acceptance, compassion, kindness and trust in God to be that omnipotent being more than capable of sorting our actions out. Everyone thinks they're right: Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, Wiccan.........Here's a concept: What if they're all right? What if they're all wrong? The point being we can believe but we can't know. To believe we know, we're back to presuming we know the mind of God. And I'm personally just not that arrogant.

'Rani

[Chreees]

I guess I should make it more clear- I believe the Bible is not God's [b]direct[/b] word. Humans, as we know it, don't always get things right, and we very often exaggerate things. Stories passed down generation to generation get changed over time, stuff being exaggerated or added as the story is told again. I believe this is probably what happened with the Bible. I'm a Christian because I believe in Jesus Christ... I believe the Bible is somwhat true, just probably things didn't go down exactly as it's told. And about other religions, I totally respect them... We all have to believe in something. It doesn't necessarily matter [i]what[/i] you believe, just so long as you [i]do[/i] believe. So... I'm a Christian who doesn't like any certain denomination due to hypocrisy and believes the Bible is exaggerated, lol.

[Rani]

[quote name='INCUBUSRATM' date='24 March 2010 - 10:16 AM' timestamp='1269454566' post='459294']
I guess I should make it more clear- I believe the Bible is not God's [b]direct[/b] word. Humans, as we know it, don't always get things right, and we very often exaggerate things. Stories passed down generation to generation get changed over time, stuff being exaggerated or added as the story is told again. I believe this is probably what happened with the Bible. I'm a Christian because I believe in Jesus Christ... I believe the Bible is somwhat true, just probably things didn't go down exactly as it's told. And about other religions, I totally respect them... We all have to believe in something. It doesn't necessarily matter [i]what[/i] you believe, just so long as you [i]do[/i] believe. So... I'm a Christian who doesn't like any certain denomination due to hypocrisy and believes the Bible is exaggerated, lol.
[/quote]

[font="Arial"]There is also some historical facts. A huge portion of the Bible was likely actually written in Egypt. The way that came about was after the death of Alexander, Ptolemy took over Egypt as his portion of the spoils. Influenced by Alexander and Macedonian culture that cherished learning, he established laws that gave the equivalent of room and board to any writer or artist under the condition that they leave a copy of their work in the Great Library. This went on for a couple centuries and archeologists believe that the original texts of the Bible were composed within the Library because of this support by the nation of Egypt. There is some documentation that the original disciples did visit Egypt so it's a logical premise. Things went along generally fine until [/font][size="2"][font="Arial"]Coptic Christian Archbishop Theophilus decided almost everything within the library threatened the growing power of the church (some of it apparently challenged the church endorsed dogma) and ordered the Serapeum destroyed. (There are a couple other fires that could have destroyed the Library, but the church intentionally took credit for removing the Library's sometimes pagan doctrine from the world.)[/font][/size]

[size="2"][font="Arial"]There's a legend that the head librarian at the time was warned about the intended destruction and loaded as many of the documents he could onto a ship which sailed out of Alexandra in order to transport them to a safe location for preservation but the ship was never heard from. Speculation is that it either sunk at sea in a storm (if it existed in the first place), or managed to make safe port and hid the documents so that they wouldn't be seized and destroyed. Archeologists have been looking for them and remains of the Library itself ever since. Should they find it we might find the original texts as written. I suspect that would be a world changing event.[/font][/size]

[size="2"][font="Arial"]While I accept the historical value of the Bible and believe there are a great many valuable lessons in it, as a student of history, there are just too many times when the governments and churches of the times decided portions of it should be changed or left out altogether. (The Apocrypha being the best known.) It is a man altered document. It doesn't mean it doesn't have value but no one can logical deny it's been changed several times. [/font][/size]

[size="2"][font="Arial"]End of thread jack, lol........ (Though I guess we only went down a sideline as the Bible is the most common reason people give for choosing celibacy.)[/font][/size]

[size="2"][font="Arial"]'Rani[/font][/size]