Talking Politics.

[mushrat]

Using inflammatory push button terms as Liberal, Conservative, bleeding heart, and other popular meaningless labels shall we? Lets face it, these terms are merely used by one group to make another group look bad or elicit a knee jerk response and to avoid the actual issue at hand.

I am proposing using party names only to designate a particular person's stated affiliation, as opposed to "all democrats are against guns" and the like. He's a Republican Reprentative to the House would be acceptable, what do you think? because if we don't figure out a way to talk politics on this hookah forum in a laid back, chill kinda way where we state our opinion and then LISTEN to others instead of attack them I'm going to send all the polital topic to the trash bin and direct people to political forums if they wanna beat each toher around. What do you all think?

[Venger]

well (sigh) this is where things get sticky. It all comes down to the intent of the word used. I have always tried very hard to be kind and explain how I am using a word when I use it. I am proudly fiscally conservative and somewhat socially liberal. When asked in another thread how I defined these terms I thought I did so clearly. What bothers me more is the associations people make with these words. Not all republicans are conservative and not all democrats are liberal. I would rather people stop stereotyping and uses these terms with an explanation of what they mean by it. I do however strongly object to mud slinging and name calling.libtard is UNACCEPTABLE as is anything defaming any other group. You wouldn't use racial slurs why is it OK in this case? It not and your Mother would be very disappointed with your behavior.
Be nice,give the same kindness you expect back and most of all please be open minded that you just might be wrong.I know I am all the time.
(wrong that it)
Ray

[mustafabey]

If we can't discuss our views with others in a rational and adult manner, then toss it all in the trash bin. The political climate in America is presently very divided. In the 60's it was also of a similar combustible nature and people died.
Everyone has a different perspective on the issues and we need to respect anothers opinion. Trashing people and their ideas does no one any good. I call myself an independent and have little use for either parties rhetoric. I am liberal on many social issues and conservative fiscally and in regards to foreign policy. I vote for the candidate and not the party. My own representative is a conservative Republican and I disagree with some of his stances and voting record, yet when it comes to this district he is all about the people here. I had income tax issues and he interceded for me with the IRS to accept the payment I had suggested and the IRS turned down. I paid my back taxes in an affordable manner. When the Corps of Engineers wanted to dam up our creek and create a resevior for folks way downstream, he made sure it was killed. Whe November comes Bob will get my vote!

[Rani]

While I think Mush, you have a valid principle to offer, the reality of where each person stands on issues can't be clearly defined. I'm very liberal on some issues, extremely right wing on others. Not all Democrats are liberal, and not all Republicans are conservative. The generalities don't really work when you come up against passionate beliefs. I do think we all need to be more conscious and respectful of others beliefs. But in a way this forum is like any big family with a bunch of siblings. Sometimes we argue, sometimes we even get out of hand and do a little name calling and Daddy Mush has to slap us around a little and send us to our rooms. Yet the very same people we were fighting with yesterday will have our back when we need something - even long distance. We are very much like a family including all the laughter and fights families do.

You know we'll try and be better behaved and we'll even pull it off for a while, but we'll slip up and act stupid again. And you'll send us to our rooms. As any good parent should.

And I say it with all the love and respect int he world when I say..... You knew it was a tough job when you took it, Dad.

'Rani

[mushrat]

[quote name='Rani' date='02 June 2010 - 03:27 PM' timestamp='1275506840' post='470338']
While I think Mush, you have a valid principle to offer, the reality of where each person stands on issues can't be clearly defined. I'm very liberal on some issues, extremely right wing on others. Not all Democrats are liberal, and not all Republicans are conservative. The generalities don't really work when you come up against passionate beliefs. I do think we all need to be more conscious and respectful of others beliefs. But in a way this forum is like any big family with a bunch of siblings. Sometimes we argue, sometimes we even get out of hand and do a little name calling and Daddy Mush has to slap us around a little and send us to our rooms. Yet the very same people we were fighting with yesterday will have our back when we need something - even long distance. We are very much like a family including all the laughter and fights families do.

You know we'll try and be better behaved and we'll even pull it off for a while, but we'll slip up and act stupid again. And you'll send us to our rooms. As any good parent should.

And I say it with all the love and respect int he world when I say..... You knew it was a tough job when you took it, Dad.

'Rani
[/quote]

Ha! almost snorted beer back up through my nose.

You all get the idea I guess..just keep it civil ok?

[no longer welcome]

This is exactly why I don't post in any political, religious, or other controversial threads. Too many people get offended when a side s taken, especially in heated topics. None of you know which side I lean towards, nor do I feel the need to tell you. I like to come here for the hookah conversations. I do visit other forums that are made to discuss political issues and no matter how respectful they are of each other the flaming does continue. Your efforts are appreciated Mush, it's a tough job.

[thatonethere]

I agree with your stance on this Mush. People get all caught up in whose stance fits whatever label that fits that so called stereotype. It's just a discussion and people are going to say how they feel. Whose to say that someone can't feel how they feel surrounding a particular issue. Calling names and acting arrogant doesn't validate opinions, it just makes the person seem pompus.

If you decide to take the discussion down, then so be it. However if the political discussion board can be a grounds for civilized discussion without mud slinging and cutting people down, then more power to the people on the forum.

[acolorado]

Well, I'm here to own up to the fact that I've been a contributor to this problem, rather than part of the solution.

At the time I get involved, I always feel that I have my reasons, as anyone who has been called terrible things for their political beliefs will understand. I've been called a Communist, a Socialist, a Libtard, a terrorist-sympathizer, and unAmerican simply for believing in what many others here also believe and for being happy to discuss it. As often as not I respond in kind to these insults, which may be a very human reaction but is nonetheless probably exactly what the other person was hoping for, and reflects terribly on my own lack of self-control. I allow myself to get dragged into a juvenile argument where whatever facts I bring to the table are irrelevant, and I just have to remember that at that point it's not about political discussion, it's all about people venting their frustrations with life on others, using politics, or religion, or whatever as the vehicle for it.

There's no excuse for name-calling and hurtful insinuations, and I readily admit I've done both and am grateful to the mods for calling me out on it and taking action. I come here to share my passion for hookah with other like minded folks - and getting involved in personal arguments never ends well and just distracts me from what I love about this place. Although I may contribute to serious discussion threads in the future, I will make sure to keep it civil and reasonable on my end. Mostly I think I'll just stick to the other areas of the forum.

I apologize for contributing to the disruption on the forums, for my hurtful personal comments towards others, and for causing both Mush and INCUB some stress they don't come here for either and really don't need.

To wrap up on a much more pleasant note, I've been smoking some Al-Waha Sultani today, and it's hitting just the right spot. Life is good. I hope everyone else is having as good a day as I am.

[mushrat]

[quote name='acolorado' date='03 June 2010 - 01:12 AM' timestamp='1275541965' post='470444']
Well, I'm here to own up to the fact that I've been a contributor to this problem, rather than part of the solution.

At the time I get involved, I always feel that I have my reasons, as anyone who has been called terrible things for their political beliefs will understand. I've been called a Communist, a Socialist, a Libtard, a terrorist-sympathizer, and unAmerican simply for believing in what many others here also believe and for being happy to discuss it. As often as not I respond in kind to these insults, which may be a very human reaction but is nonetheless probably exactly what the other person was hoping for, and reflects terribly on my own lack of self-control. I allow myself to get dragged into a juvenile argument where whatever facts I bring to the table are irrelevant, and I just have to remember that at that point it's not about political discussion, it's all about people venting their frustrations with life on others, using politics, or religion, or whatever as the vehicle for it.

There's no excuse for name-calling and hurtful insinuations, and I readily admit I've done both and am grateful to the mods for calling me out on it and taking action. I come here to share my passion for hookah with other like minded folks - and getting involved in personal arguments never ends well and just distracts me from what I love about this place. Although I may contribute to serious discussion threads in the future, I will make sure to keep it civil and reasonable on my end. Mostly I think I'll just stick to the other areas of the forum.

I apologize for contributing to the disruption on the forums, for my hurtful personal comments towards others, and for causing both Mush and INCUB some stress they don't come here for either and really don't need.

To wrap up on a much more pleasant note, I've been smoking some Al-Waha Sultani today, and it's hitting just the right spot. Life is good. I hope everyone else is having as good a day as I am.
[/quote]

The apology is happily accepted.
And believe me, I can get just as drawn in on some subjects so I fully understand. This is why i only chime in once in a blue moon on these political/religious discussions and then only with a bunch of links to back up my opinion.

[TheScotsman]

Now we all know I would never find myself wrapped up in any such event, don't we?


I enjoy a good political argument, maybe too much.
My apology to anyone that may have been offended, nothing was ever meant as a personal insult.

Being the sort that will enjoy any argument, I seldom find one I can resist...

Acolorado, I can sympathize, I get the other end of those same terms. I would like to extend a personal apology to you, my friend. We seem to be polar opposites with regard all things in the socio-political universe. That is not really a good reason to flick verbal-boogers at eachother. I will agree, political discussions, while once pretty tame, are getting far more heated. IMNHO, you would be right, in your thought that such "unfriendly discussions" reflect frustration; I myself don't find frustration very common in life... I just fall into the argumentative & opinionated about everything category-Don't take it personally, it was never intended as such.

[NitetimeReign]

I really like your approach on this mush. This is the first time I have posted in the serious discussions thread as I know arguements tend to happen over differen't beliefs. That being said, I just wish peace, love, and happiness for ALL. I know that doesn't mean all will get it, but it is my wish none the less.

[Venger]

I figure arguing here is like arguing with my family. We yell,we shout,we call each others names but at the end of the night I will be sitting down and having dinner with them and laughing about something else. No one should take a good argument personally at the end of the day we will all be making fun of Chris on TinyChat and laughing.
Ray

[Chreees]

[quote name='Venger' date='15 June 2010 - 07:14 PM' timestamp='1276647272' post='471766']
I figure arguing here is like arguing with my family. We yell,we shout,we call each others names but at the end of the night I will be sitting down and having dinner with them and laughing about something else. No one should take a good argument personally [b]at the end of the day we will all be making fun of Chris on TinyChat and laughing.[/b]
Ray
[/quote]

Riiiight...

[mushrat]

except *I* have to handle all the butt hurt people.

so lets just do it my way cause I'm the Daddy ok?

[Vladimir]

[quote name='mushrat' date='15 June 2010 - 07:17 PM' timestamp='1276654652' post='471776']
except *I* have to handle all the butt hurt people.

so lets just do it my way cause I'm the Daddy ok?
[/quote]

I vote ban butt-hurt people.

But I am guilty of throwing words around. But this is a series of tubes, if it was not invented for making fun of liberals, what is it good for?

[mushrat]

*sigh*

[Chreees]

[quote name='mushrat' date='19 June 2010 - 09:31 AM' timestamp='1276957869' post='472128']
*sigh*
[/quote]

x2