I Doubt This Will Pass But Shits About To Hit The Fan...

[TheScotsman]

and the dems bring you charlie "da-crook" wrangle, chris "I need a neg interest rate mortgage" dodd, tax evader-geithner, and all those other czar buddies of his that can't seem to pay their own taxes. cash-in-the-freezer-guy from Louisiana, john "where's my yacht" kerry. Teddy "[i]Schwimmwagen[/i]" kennedy... pointy-hood-guy byrd. the list goes on, but I am out of witty names for them at the moment.

Hey how about that fine democrat congress whats the president to have the right to seize any/all internet records from any company at the president's will, then make it a crime for anyone at that company to reveal that the government has seized anything, to anyone. Giving the gov't the right to snoop in any private network them deem "critical", any time they feel any desire to. Nice transparency from the administration. Wait didn't he PROMISE to be the most transparent admin ever? He is breaking a promise... again! That makes him a what????


you confuse republicans with conservatives, with tea party, with constitutional libertarians. Until you actually figure out what each of them are, and the policies they support, irrelevancy and an inability to make any sense whatsoever seems to permeate your statements in an astounding fashion.


Personally, I don't fall into the "conservative" or republican niche at all. I am more of the far-end of a literal constitutionalists.

Now, acolorado, my boulderite-friend, get to work, To avoid next years CG taxes, I sold a bunch of G.E (I have grown to hate them, and the fact they are in the pres's pocket anyway) I just bought myself a new 990 adventure S. I know I am going to fall off sometime, and once you go past that 40 age, things seem to get broken far too easy. I want my free 'bamacare to be paid-up, As a protest of the system, I am planning to fully utilize my freebies, after all it is my right to do so... you voted for it! You got some taxes to pay, get to it, son! (said with all possible friendly sarcastic tone... don't get your panties in a bunch again.)

who is "they" and "many". I am seeing more weasel-worded propaganda statements. Must be poached from the DNC talking points website.

[Rani]

[quote name='Tyler' date='29 July 2010 - 02:27 AM' timestamp='1280395668' post='476925']
[quote name='Rani' date='29 July 2010 - 01:24 AM' timestamp='1280381066' post='476914']
[quote name='TheScotsman' date='28 July 2010 - 08:27 PM' timestamp='1280374058' post='476898']
State of war, and declaration of war are completely different conditions.

Poached from one of the DA's legal volumes:

[i]War is not only an act, but a state or condition, for nations are said to be at war not only when their armies are engaged, so as to be in the very act of contention, but also when, they have any matter of controversy or dispute subsisting between them which they are determined to decide by the use of force, and have declared publicly, or by their acts, their determination so to decide it. [/i]

I think the key part of the statement is "[i]...state or condition, for nations are said to be at war not only when their armies are engaged, so as to be in the very act of contention..." [/i]I would take that to define a state of war to be as simple as any international disagreement. Not, as one would assume, a declared war by congress. Living with a lawyer has made me overly suspicious of specific language.

[i]
[/i]In any case, it's an extension of the same logic that created the "public service" requirement for HS graduation that has been indoctrinating the mind numbed young masses. It's public slavery under another name. Get used to it. It's not going away in your lifetime.

Anyone that thinks Canada wants them over their inability to stand up for their own rights, is not facing reality, they don't want your hypocritical, BS there. Elections have consequences. You vote for the people that don't want to keep score in sports, think red pens are too harsh, and we all need to work for the betterment of the collective, rather than themselves, and their family, this is what you get. Wake the hell up. quit believing the BS spewed by the agenda driven media, the teacher's unions, and assorted other dead-beats. Find out what the politicians are planning for your life, preferably before you put them in charge of your life... and quit reciting the stupid one-line bumper sticker campaign slogans.

Or don't. I really don't care. Oh, by the way, thanks for the free retirement, and healthcare you are paying. I got mine from this world, now you and your grandchildren need to get to work and pay my healthcare, and retirement costs. so get the hell away from the hookah, and get to work... because that is what you voted to do for me. (really, that is meant with all possible scarcasim. Don't take it wrong. My generation lived every benefit of this nation, but has completely screwed up the responsibilities that came with it. In the end, those of us that ended the "baby boom" have cost this nation, and all you younger people so much more than you will ever know. It is really a complete embarrassment. I vote we blame RANI for the whole mess.:774_smiley_getting_kicked_in_thLast election I thought they all sucked. Out of protest I voted for my cat as president. Unfortunately, "Just-Kat" lost. It's looking like he would have been a better choice.[i]
[/i]
[/quote]

Long as you quit blaming Democrats to the exclusion of the other rotten bastards, I'll take it. Come on Scotsman, give up. None of them are worth a rats ass. [b][size="7"]And if people aren't willing to defend the country they shouldn't be living here.
[/size][/b]
'Rani
[/quote]

QFT

There are many ways to "defend" ones country
[/quote]

Absolutely! I have a damaged knee. And I'm not 21 so combat isn't really an option for people like me. But if we were under attack and in a declared war, I'd be the first one at the gate offering to put my skill set to work. There is absolutely nothing wrong with working for the nation in ways that do not cross your particular moral code. Some Consciencous Objectors served during the Vietnam war era though they objected to combat service. And their service was both accepted and appreciated.

'Rani

[acolorado]

[quote name='TheScotsman' date='29 July 2010 - 10:53 AM' timestamp='1280422404' post='476952']
and the dems bring you charlie "da-crook" wrangle, chris "I need a neg interest rate mortgage" dodd, tax evader-geithner, and all those other czar buddies of his that can't seem to pay their own taxes. cash-in-the-freezer-guy from Louisiana, john "where's my yacht" kerry. Teddy "[i]Schwimmwagen[/i]" kennedy... pointy-hood-guy byrd. the list goes on, but I am out of witty names for them at the moment.

Hey how about that fine democrat congress whats the president to have the right to seize any/all internet records from any company at the president's will, then make it a crime for anyone at that company to reveal that the government has seized anything, to anyone. Giving the gov't the right to snoop in any private network them deem "critical", any time they feel any desire to. Nice transparency from the administration. Wait didn't he PROMISE to be the most transparent admin ever? He is breaking a promise... again! That makes him a what????


you confuse republicans with conservatives, with tea party, with constitutional libertarians. Until you actually figure out what each of them are, and the policies they support, irrelevancy and an inability to make any sense whatsoever seems to permeate your statements in an astounding fashion.


Personally, I don't fall into the "conservative" or republican niche at all. I am more of the far-end of a literal constitutionalists.

Now, acolorado, my boulderite-friend, get to work, To avoid next years CG taxes, I sold a bunch of G.E (I have grown to hate them, and the fact they are in the pres's pocket anyway) I just bought myself a new 990 adventure S. I know I am going to fall off sometime, and once you go past that 40 age, things seem to get broken far too easy. I want my free 'bamacare to be paid-up, As a protest of the system, I am planning to fully utilize my freebies, after all it is my right to do so... you voted for it! You got some taxes to pay, get to it, son! (said with all possible friendly sarcastic tone... don't get your panties in a bunch again.)

who is "they" and "many". I am seeing more weasel-worded propaganda statements. Must be poached from the DNC talking points website.
[/quote]

Of course when I say they and many I really mean you bud.

And since even you can't keep straight what you support, I'm not feeling too bad about not understanding where you're coming from .

Your claim that you're not a conservative is pretty funny though. Thanks for giving me a good laugh for today.

In fact - I'll claim I'm not even a liberal - I'm a Constitutional Literalist too - except I actually know what it's called. And you may have a right to use all the freebies you always rail against - doesn't make you a criminal after all - but it does make you a hyp... hyp... oops think I need to sneeze.

Btw I also liked where you call the Pres a liar - at the same time you throw out so many things that turn out to not be true. Maybe the experience just gives you a better eye for it.

And since we're joking around in a friendly way - those weren't my panties in a twist - they were yo mama's!

Man - I actually enjoy our little spats here. I probably need some therapy.

[porksandwich9113]

[quote name='Rani' date='29 July 2010 - 12:24 AM' timestamp='1280381066' post='476914']


Long as you quit blaming Democrats to the exclusion of the other rotten bastards, I'll take it. Come on Scotsman, give up. None of them are worth a rats ass. [b][size=5]And if people aren't willing to defend the country they shouldn't be living here.[/size][/b]

'Rani
[/quote]

My idea of defending this country is defending it's ideas of freedom. Privacy. Equality. Things that have stood in this country for 200 years.
When we fight a war now - we don't fight for that. We have not been in a war for Freedom or Equality for a long time.
We fight for Oil. We fight for profit. We fight to control others. If we cared about freedom and equality we would be in places like Darfur.
On top of that of that..look at the laws the government has passed since "9/11."

This country doesn't even stick it's pinky finger in something foreign that doesn't have a chance for profit.

[Rani]

[quote name='porksandwich9113' date='29 July 2010 - 03:32 PM' timestamp='1280442735' post='476992']
[quote name='Rani' date='29 July 2010 - 12:24 AM' timestamp='1280381066' post='476914']
Long as you quit blaming Democrats to the exclusion of the other rotten bastards, I'll take it. Come on Scotsman, give up. None of them are worth a rats ass. [b][size="5"]And if people aren't willing to defend the country they shouldn't be living here.[/size][/b]

'Rani
[/quote]

My idea of defending this country is defending it's ideas of freedom. Privacy. Equality. Things that have stood in this country for 200 years.
When we fight a war now - we don't fight for that. We have not been in a war for Freedom or Equality for a long time.
We fight for Oil. We fight for profit. We fight to control others. If we cared about freedom and equality we would be in places like Darfur.
On top of that of that..look at the laws the government has passed since "9/11."

This country doesn't even stick it's pinky finger in something foreign that doesn't have a chance for profit.
[/quote]


I'm a weird case. I don't think we should have gone after Bin Laden at all. I think we should have pumped all that money into securing our borders. I kind of get that there's this almost ego issue where someone attacks and we have to respond, but a nation didn't attack. One man's lunatic group did, and in response we formulate and carry out massive attacks on foreign soil. You can't even really call them counter strikes, because there haven't been any further attacks on American soil. Some attempts yes, but increasing internal security is, I believe, the way to handle it. Not invading a foreign and sovereign nation - even if it is in 3rd world status and harboring a relatively small (considering size of world population) terrorist group. It's our rush to invade that is part of the reason we've made so many enemies throughout history in the international community. We really need to stop meddling and start taking care of our own nation. Immigration is a joke and it's at least half the problem that allowed 9/11 to happen in the first place. And in response the then current administration/Congress instituted the Patriot Act which is anything but patriotic. It's the most damaging legislation ever passed infringing on civil liberties and it's clearly equally usable against both native citizens and immigrants. Something is inherently wrong with a government that suspects it's own citizenry on an equal par with "everybody else" who may have, at least in their own minds, reason to despise the US.

Were it the United States of Rani I would have unleashed the CIA or whoever is doing "black ops" as the movies call it, to do their worst and handled it that way. Through targeted assassination for example. Oh, but I forget..... We abhor that, don't we? No, instead we want to invade nations, killing civilians along the way. Even in government, the guy who writes the checks gets to make the rules. Unfortunately we keep letting them.

'Rani

[TheScotsman]

[quote name='Rani' date='29 July 2010 - 06:26 PM' timestamp='1280446005' post='476999']
[quote name='porksandwich9113' date='29 July 2010 - 03:32 PM' timestamp='1280442735' post='476992']
[quote name='Rani' date='29 July 2010 - 12:24 AM' timestamp='1280381066' post='476914']
Long as you quit blaming Democrats to the exclusion of the other rotten bastards, I'll take it. Come on Scotsman, give up. None of them are worth a rats ass. [b][size="5"]And if people aren't willing to defend the country they shouldn't be living here.[/size][/b]

'Rani
[/quote]

My idea of defending this country is defending it's ideas of freedom. Privacy. Equality. Things that have stood in this country for 200 years.
When we fight a war now - we don't fight for that. We have not been in a war for Freedom or Equality for a long time.
We fight for Oil. We fight for profit. We fight to control others. If we cared about freedom and equality we would be in places like Darfur.
On top of that of that..look at the laws the government has passed since "9/11."

This country doesn't even stick it's pinky finger in something foreign that doesn't have a chance for profit.
[/quote]


I'm a weird case. I don't think we should have gone after Bin Laden at all. I think we should have pumped all that money into securing our borders. I kind of get that there's this almost ego issue where someone attacks and we have to respond, but a nation didn't attack. One man's lunatic group did, and in response we formulate and carry out massive attacks on foreign soil. You can't even really call them counter strikes, because there haven't been any further attacks on American soil. Some attempts yes, but increasing internal security is, I believe, the way to handle it. Not invading a foreign and sovereign nation - even if it is in 3rd world status and harboring a relatively small (considering size of world population) terrorist group. It's our rush to invade that is part of the reason we've made so many enemies throughout history in the international community. We really need to stop meddling and start taking care of our own nation. Immigration is a joke and it's at least half the problem that allowed 9/11 to happen in the first place. And in response the then current administration/Congress instituted the Patriot Act which is anything but patriotic. It's the most damaging legislation ever passed infringing on civil liberties and it's clearly equally usable against both native citizens and immigrants. Something is inherently wrong with a government that suspects it's own citizenry on an equal par with "everybody else" who may have, at least in their own minds, reason to despise the US.

Were it the United States of Rani I would have unleashed the CIA or whoever is doing "black ops" as the movies call it, to do their worst and handled it that way. Through targeted assassination for example. Oh, but I forget..... We abhor that, don't we? No, instead we want to invade nations, killing civilians along the way. Even in government, the guy who writes the checks gets to make the rules. Unfortunately we keep letting them.

'Rani
[/quote]

Chasing Bin Laden is like catching a firefly, once you do, it's just a bug, and another starts lighting up right away.
Freedom is something the US gov't says the rest of the world needs, all the while taking away any freedoms they can in the USA.

Internal security is nothing but handing a win to the terrorists. Every time some regular schlub has to take off his shoes, and carry his 2-oz of shampoo in a clear zip lock, the terrorists win. Every time another camera is pointed at us, they win again. I agree that our borders would be first, and foremost. There is no way to succeed in being anything more than reactionary as long as anyone can come in anywhere, with almost zero chance of being even seen, much less intercepted. That, unfortunately, is not going to change as long as the Mexican border is a free-for-all, and we can't find a president with the balls to do anything to secure it. Based on that fact alone, the war is lost and we are toooooo dumb to figure it out, and the question becomes not if the terrorists are going to make another "home run" attack... but when, and where. (I feel safe, Leech Lake, MN isn't likely on the "A" list of targets.) Let's face it, all the security in the world isn't going to do a thing to prevent it, as long as we can't even figure out what foreign nationals are actually in the country.

I agree that the conflict in both Afg, and Iraq have been misshandled from the beginning. Wars are won when the indigineous civilian population decide the price is too high, and they turn on their officials. No one has ever won a conflict by rebuilding a nation for the enemy. any ROE that disallows targeting civilians is just suicidal. No war has ever ended under those conditions. Dresden broke Germany's will to fight, Hiroshima, and Nagasaki did the same in Japan. When the Italians decided they had put up with enough, Mosulini was hung in the street, and gutted like a pig. I guess, if I have a point, it is that the conflict either needs to be fought as an all-in war, or we need to clear out. What we are doing now is a recipe for disaster. Helping a few of the enemy leadership take a dirt-nap is a good start, but making the civilians so sick of war that they start to make it unsafe for the enemy, that is the only war to win. Assuming, of course, the goal is victory, and an exit. Targeting the leadership is a good start, but you are never going to get a guest commentator job at NPR with any opinion that supports such.

Lastly, the USA needs to quit passing out cash to the rest of the world. First, because we are broke! (and borrowing from China, to give to the likes of Pakistan is irrational on every level.) Secondly, and IMNHO, more importantly, as we are propping up some unpopular government with large influxes of cash, we are causing a growing resentment in the local population. Finally, that population decides we are the problem, not the assholes we are keeping in power with our borrowed billions. Damn, it's no wonder the USA is not so popular, eh? How many times do you think we are going to have to see that same pattern before we figure it out? The USA needs to withdraw from most little international BS, keep out few allies at hand, and be done with the turd-world. When we have to respond to a foreign problem, it would be an all-out... see-you-in-the-stone-age retaliation against everyone that even looked like they hinted at supporting the enemy. Strength, and fear inspire respect, groveling, and going on a world-bowing tour don't.

One lesson we have never managed to learn... the world is full of assholes, and when you stick your finger in the middle of them, all you get back is a stinky finger. (my contribution to wisdom, as it is.)

[agunn1231]

I tend to not take part in political discussions, but all I gotta say about this one is that I don't agree with it. and it's funny, last semester I had to write a paper in english class about my opinion on mandatory national service.

[SaintPendulous]

[quote name='Tyler' date='27 July 2010 - 12:24 AM' timestamp='1280208244' post='476485']
[url="http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-5741"]http://www.govtrack....?bill=h111-5741[/url]

Yeah, I'm not sure what I think of this but..hmm....
[/quote]

oh wow man.....Isnt it in the Constitution that the government can not re-institute the draft?

[Stuie]

[quote name='Dogseatfood' date='27 July 2010 - 03:30 PM' timestamp='1280262603' post='476644']
One: Will not pass.

[b]Two: I'm fat. [/b]

Three: I'm just registering for the draft... ugh.
[/quote]

Sign him up for Operation: Human Shield.

[Rani]

[quote name='TheAaronMichalski' date='01 August 2010 - 10:16 PM' timestamp='1280726199' post='477313']
[quote name='Tyler' date='27 July 2010 - 12:24 AM' timestamp='1280208244' post='476485']
[url="http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-5741"]http://www.govtrack....?bill=h111-5741[/url]

Yeah, I'm not sure what I think of this but..hmm....
[/quote]

oh wow man.....Isnt it in the Constitution that the government can not re-institute the draft?
[/quote]

I don't believe that's the case, but regardless the Constitution is a living document. It's subject to change. Supposedly according to the will of the people but we haven't had an real input in over a hundred years.

'Rani

[wiz12]

first of all im in the service, i would like to share my experince!
when i got to boot camp i was 20 and this was my last choice of a carrer but coming from a small town i have no work oppertunities so therfor i joined. i was 20 and i was immature and loved to party and have TOO much fun at home. boot camp was easy but it tought me more about what life is and mostly i became mature withing a few months after. i am very proud to serve and i love the fact that i no longer depend on anyone and i have make an excelent carrer choice. even if i dont stay in there is so much benifits from being in the military that i would have no problem finding a job on the outside.
the FULL GI BILL is avalible for you after 2 years of service im proud to say i am using this and making my way to a BA. this is one of the best things i have done with my life and i would never say anything bad about our military.

Next, every other country in the world makes it manditory for any male of age to serve in thier armed forces for atleast 4 years so be happy this is just during a war time thing.

i hope it gets passed because i think our country needs this and it will help our youth realise the importance of our armed forces!
mine you i am only 22 years old but i have seen things i never thought i would see and yet i come home everynight to my loving wife. i get thanks almost everyday from people when i go out in my uniform and theres something about that, that just makes you feel good knowing people respect what you do to help our country.

if any of you younger people or just anyone intrested in joining and want more info and what it really is feel free to msg me anytime

thank you,

[noodle]

I wonder what this would mean for someone who works for a defense contractor in some fashion.

[Balthazar]

First of all, the whole "one year of free college for each year served" would probably just mean a continuation of the trend where poor people have to serve in the military to be able to study, while rich kids don't have to (if you have the option not to serve, that is). Secondly, how would this system work? You build a couple of hundred new universities, remove all forms of requirements for entry and randomly assign people to different universities? Or should they be able to choose freely?

I think it's a good idea on paper, but I highly doubt it would work very well in practice. And I'm not huge on the forced service thing.

"You all getting the feeling we would be heading like old Russia?"

Yup. Imperial overstretch and all that jazz. Edited September 5, 2010 by Balthazar