magick777 Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 I've been asked for pics and reviews on the Saphire Hot Shot bowl[b] [/b]that I acquired yesterday. [b]This is not yet a review,[/b] as I intend to test the bowls multiple times and with multiple brands of shisha before reaching a firm judgement[b], and I will post a review in the correct forum when ready. [/b]Hence I'm going to hold back on giving scores, but some pics and a smoke report might be in order. Comments and discussion invited. The key selling point of this bowl is the claim that it smokes for 30-45 minutes on 4-6 grams of shisha and consumes it fully, thanks to the following design: [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110131_005.jpg[/img] That's a 7cm bowl, but the tobacco goes in the middle, vaguely like a Crown I suppose. The quality of manufacture and glaze is better than the flash photo would suggest, the spot on the rim at the left is a defect, but a trivial one. Doesn't take much tobacco, either, a heaped teaspoon wouldn't all fit. The photo below is a pinch of Nakhla Two Apples, the first tobacco we tested it with. [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110131_006.jpg[/img] One sheet of Belgian-made, Alufoil branded precut heavy-duty foil... no idea what's the best hole pattern for this bowl, so we'll try this... [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110131_010.jpg[/img] oh, and some coals might help... two pieces of Abo Alabed natural Syrian olive wood coals, each about 2" long. Placed like this they did absolutely nothing, had to stick em on the foil to start getting enough heat to the shisha. 'Scuse the mess. [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110131_011.jpg[/img] Once the coals were moved onto the foil, the bowl began to smoke after about one minute and initially, the flavour was weak and the smoke was relatively thin. Certainly it did not kick in as hard and fast as a Vortex, presumably thanks to the air space between the foil and the shisha. However, after less than ten minutes, it was producing very good flavour and respectable clouds, certainly on a par with many Egyptian bowls I've had. Sure, not the clouds I get from a Vortex, but not the harshness, scorching or waste either. In total, we smoked continuously for 42 minutes (three people, taking three or four turns apiece) before the coals were too small to be useful and the flavour all but gone. All of it was pleasant, at least thirty minutes of that was decent clouds of smoke with very good flavour, and that's with barely a teaspoonful of Nakhla. We found that better clouds were achieved with a slow long draw; this bowl does not reward aggressive smokers, but it does provide excellent flavour and a more than acceptable thickness of smoke. And the end result is: [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110131_024.jpg[/img] This photo shows the underside of the plug of tobacco afterwards; supporting the claim that it uses shisha fully. And yes, it is the same size as a fifty pence piece. Draw from that your own conclusions. Right now, I'm too impressed to review it impartially, so I'll come back to that in a few days. We did have a slightly underwhelming flavour experience from Nakhla Mint with this same bowl - but even that was on a par with the typical shisha cafe, I normally burn the hell out of it in an Egyptian bowl for aggressive amounts of menthol, which this bowl won't let you do. It did however smoke perfectly acceptably for half an hour or more, it just wasn't as intense as I might have made it on another bowl (or could have made it by overfilling this one). I think before I review this fully I'd better try it with AF and Tang, too, but suffice it to say that I won't be selling either of mine any time soon, and I might even buy a couple spares. Very, very happy indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainUM Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 dude, this bowl sounds promising for those, like the UKer's, who might want to save shitloads of shisha when they smoke. i wish they had some in the US to try Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cheng Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Damn that looks sick! A tiny bit of nak for half an hours smoke is great for those rush to go class situations. Puts my alien to shame lol. Keep the pics coming, I want to see that phunnel in use! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rani Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Looks very interesting and I love the style on the notes, lol...... Can't wait for the full review. Rani Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nars2k Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Seems promising, great bowl for a short session. Give us your impressions of their funnel as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epoch Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 Does it smoke well fully packed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcane Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 besides aesthestics, how is this any different from an egyptian? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magick777 Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Epoch' timestamp='1296610967' post='496505'] Does it smoke well fully packed? [/quote] I haven't tested that yet; the manufacturer claims it can, and that flexibility is one of the things I want to try before I review. That being said, the main case for this bowl is the tobacco saving and short duration. I expect it to work, but, if I want a larger smoke from more shisha, then I'd likely opt for a wider bowl anyway. So I'll try it, but, it isn't what I'd naturally do or what you'd buy this bowl for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magick777 Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Arcane' timestamp='1296616759' post='496511'] besides aesthestics, how is this any different from an egyptian? [/quote] Leaving aside the aesthetics, there are a few important functional differences: 1) The tobacco goes inside the holes, not over them, so it's a flavour retaining design, more comparable with something like a Crown micro. 2) Consumption of shisha - it uses a quarter of the amount that I'd put in a comparably sized Egyptian bowl, literally one teaspoonful. 3) Airflow - like a Phunnel or a Crown, the tobacco does not block the holes and can be packed tightly without upsetting the air flow. 4) Heat distribution - also akin to a phunnel, rather than heat flowing [b]through[/b] the tobacco, it flows around the tobacco, which is heated through by the bowl. Uses the tobacco more completely; less chance of consuming the top layer and wasting the rest. I imagine, if packed and used like an Egyptian bowl, it would behave like one (and will test that soon). But, that's not quite what it's designed for... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abzy Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 i think u could put some more heat on the bowl just because there is such a big gap between the foil and tobbaco. i find that German hookah smokers are completely against the foil touching the flavour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcane Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='magick777' timestamp='1296646875' post='496540'] [quote name='Arcane' timestamp='1296616759' post='496511'] besides aesthestics, how is this any different from an egyptian? [/quote] Leaving aside the aesthetics, there are a few important functional differences: 1) The tobacco goes inside the holes, not over them, so it's a flavour retaining design, more comparable with something like a Crown micro. 2) Consumption of shisha - it uses a quarter of the amount that I'd put in a comparably sized Egyptian bowl, literally one teaspoonful. 3) Airflow - like a Phunnel or a Crown, the tobacco does not block the holes and can be packed tightly without upsetting the air flow. 4) Heat distribution - also akin to a phunnel, rather than heat flowing [b]through[/b] the tobacco, it flows around the tobacco, which is heated through by the bowl. Uses the tobacco more completely; less chance of consuming the top layer and wasting the rest. I imagine, if packed and used like an Egyptian bowl, it would behave like one (and will test that soon). But, that's not quite what it's designed for... [/quote] 1. If you put the tobacco inside the holes, you're essentially clogging them...right? How do you get any measurable draw? 2. Not really a function, but that's pretty nice. 3. It wasn't until I looked at the pictures a 3rd or 4th time, did I understand what you meant. However, if you're putting the tobacco in the holes (referencing #1), how does the tobacco NOT block the holes? 4. The heat distribution doesn't really have anything to do with the phunnel aside from the fact that air is not being pulled through the tobacco. If the tobacco isn't it direct contact with the foil and foil in direct contact with the coals, it may not be as efficient as a fully packed phunnel. You lose a great deal of conductivity via the tobacco(the optimal method of heat distribution) and instead rely on the air above the tobacco to transfer the heat, which is extremely inefficient. And with the air being prevented from passing through the tobacco, a majority of your heat is focused on the top portion of the tobacco. This is the opposite of your point #4. Unless the bowl can transfer the heat well, I'm not sure how it can use the tobacco "more completely". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EAK1791 Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='Arcane' timestamp='1296675121' post='496576'] [quote name='magick777' timestamp='1296646875' post='496540'] [quote name='Arcane' timestamp='1296616759' post='496511'] besides aesthestics, how is this any different from an egyptian? [/quote] Leaving aside the aesthetics, there are a few important functional differences: 1) The tobacco goes inside the holes, not over them, so it's a flavour retaining design, more comparable with something like a Crown micro. 2) Consumption of shisha - it uses a quarter of the amount that I'd put in a comparably sized Egyptian bowl, literally one teaspoonful. 3) Airflow - like a Phunnel or a Crown, the tobacco does not block the holes and can be packed tightly without upsetting the air flow. 4) Heat distribution - also akin to a phunnel, rather than heat flowing [b]through[/b] the tobacco, it flows around the tobacco, which is heated through by the bowl. Uses the tobacco more completely; less chance of consuming the top layer and wasting the rest. I imagine, if packed and used like an Egyptian bowl, it would behave like one (and will test that soon). But, that's not quite what it's designed for... [/quote] [b]1. If you put the tobacco inside the holes, you're essentially clogging them...right? How do you get any measurable draw?[/b] 2. Not really a function, but that's pretty nice. [b]3. It wasn't until I looked at the pictures a 3rd or 4th time, did I understand what you meant. However, if you're putting the tobacco in the holes (referencing #1), how does the tobacco NOT block the holes?[/b] 4. The heat distribution doesn't really have anything to do with the phunnel aside from the fact that air is not being pulled through the tobacco. If the tobacco isn't it direct contact with the foil and foil in direct contact with the coals, it may not be as efficient as a fully packed phunnel. You lose a great deal of conductivity via the tobacco(the optimal method of heat distribution) and instead rely on the air above the tobacco to transfer the heat, which is extremely inefficient. And with the air being prevented from passing through the tobacco, a majority of your heat is focused on the top portion of the tobacco. This is the opposite of your point #4. Unless the bowl can transfer the heat well, I'm not sure how it can use the tobacco "more completely". [/quote] I think he means inside the ring of holes, not actually inside the holes themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magick777 Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 [quote name='EAK1791' timestamp='1296675394' post='496577'] I think he means inside the ring of holes, not actually inside the holes themselves. [/quote] I think the second photo in my original post clarifies what was meant. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallMeDave Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 In the official review, I would love to see photos from the side of the bowl, with and without shisha to see the kind of shallowness, heighth, height of the shisha once in the bowl, etc. No depth perception. Looks interesting! I would love to see it in action. Still some unanswered questions for me though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magick777 Posted February 4, 2011 Author Share Posted February 4, 2011 (edited) [quote name='TheyCallMeDave' timestamp='1296683702' post='496596'] In the official review, I would love to see photos from the side of the bowl, with and without shisha to see the kind of shallowness, heighth, height of the shisha once in the bowl, etc. No depth perception. [/quote] It's hard to get a clear photo of the depth of the bowl, but hopefully these shots of packing a teaspoonful of Tangiers Lucid Apple should give an idea: The amount on the teaspoon in this first photo is the total used in loading this bowl. [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110202_003.jpg[/img] when pushed loosely off the teaspoon before packing, it looks like this... [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110202_004.jpg[/img] after that, I used the teaspoon to push it down around the edges, clearing tobacco from around the holes and piling/packing it into a cone shape. This photo is most of the way through that process, with the bowl almost ready for foiling, That teaspoonful is a generous load for this bowl, as one can see. [img]http://blue.dunnettconsultancy.net/20110202_006.jpg[/img] Update: this bowl smokes *very* nicely with Tangiers Lucid, better even than my first impressions with Nak, 55 minutes or so from that teaspoonful before I gave up, full flavour, loads of smoke. So far (off the cuff), it's a 9/10 for overall enjoyment with Nak DA, a 7/10 with Nak Mint and a 10/10 with Tang Lucid Apple. More tests in the works, review on the way soon. Loads more bowls I haven't even played with yet, but this one deserves a thorough evaluation. Further update: I also managed to drop it from a height of 2' or so onto a wooden surface, took quite a bang and didn't break. This is not how I usually treat my bowls... Edited February 4, 2011 by magick777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yasseah Posted February 4, 2011 Share Posted February 4, 2011 Do the coals really glow blue like that or is that a photo artifact? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magick777 Posted February 4, 2011 Author Share Posted February 4, 2011 [quote name='Yasseah' timestamp='1296850864' post='496783'] Do the coals really glow blue like that or is that a photo artifact? [/quote] Hehe... I have no idea why the camera did that, but yes blame it on a photo artifact. As much as I like the surreal, my coals glow red like anyone else's :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuie Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 awful lot of coal for so little shisha. You save shisha but wast coal it looks like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainUM Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 i feel like it would need more heat to cook the shisha since there is a decent amount of space between the foil and tobacco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chreees Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Personally I'm more of a fan of the tobacco being all up on the foil... Makes heat management easier, and typically yields in more flavor. Magick, have you tried packing the full bowl yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallMeDave Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Same thoughts on the coal usage... Who makes the bowl again? I would like to see their description or explaination for the bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magick777 Posted February 5, 2011 Author Share Posted February 5, 2011 Thanks for all the responses & feedback, it will all help shape the final review. I'll try to address some of the points raised here first. 1) Coals - that photo was my first attempt with this bowl, and I am not convinced either that I need that amount of coal or that I will stick with the selection of coals that happens to be available locally. It's just what I tried first; I later managed to relight a bowl of Tang Lucid with about one quarter of that amount. I don't presently have any Cocobricos (suspect that just one of those might be enough, and it certainly won't need more than the three I'd use on a larger bowl); neither do I have a windcover, which might also help. It is worth noting also that if I ended up wasting that amount of coal routinely, for the purpose of using this bowl, it would make economic sense here. Nakhla runs at £10 - £15 per 250g and with quite limited availability, while those coals are £2.50 per kg and plentiful. Over 50 of these bowls, I might use 2kg of charcoal and 250g of shisha. With my typical 7cm Egyptian bowl holding 15g, I'd need 750g of shisha and would often use two loads of coal per bowl. I haven't yet been able to test every permutation I might like to, but it is my belief that if one were using coconut coals, a wind cover and some patience, it would be possible to use less coal with good results. I'd like to test it, but doing so is not a priority for me - the coals I'm using last 45-50 minutes, which suits the bowl, they're cheap as chips, and they're about 200 yards away. Not sure I see an advantage in buying in expensive 2-hour coconut coals for a bowl that lasts 30 - 45 minutes, so I'll try it when I end up buying some for the phunnel... 2) Foil - I'm experimenting with this at the moment, with an Egyptian bowl and quicklites I always used to pack right up to the foil. Some combination of the move to flavour-retaining bowls of various different materials and hotter, natural coals has led me to scorch a few bowls, and using less coal didn't seem to help. My Vortex in particular required ridiculously proactive heat management as compared with what I'm used to. So, while I don't disagree in principle, I'm currently experimenting with other approaches, and on a small sample, using lots of heat but leaving an air gap below the foil is subjectively working better for me than packing up to the foil - and that does seem to be how most of the Saphire bowls are designed to be used. The other thing I want to try, another approach popularised by the Germans, is to pack right up to the foil but then sit the charcoal on spacer rings made of aluminium on top of the foil; I can envisage that providing far better conduction of heat. As an added bonus, with heavy duty foils, they often come out clean enough to reuse. For the sake of completeness I will try overpacking the bowl before I review... but I'm sitting here with about eight new bowls of which I've only found the time to try two. Combining my current reluctance to overpack with the temptation to try out the other bowls, it might take me a week or two.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaffaaf27 Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 what an in depth preview! really really good. just waiting for the full review and probably will buy. try packing it very tight in the middle, below the ring, and sprinkled above the holes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magick777 Posted February 5, 2011 Author Share Posted February 5, 2011 (edited) [quote name='TheyCallMeDave' timestamp='1296895520' post='496852'] Same thoughts on the coal usage... Who makes the bowl again? I would like to see their description or explaination for the bowl. [/quote] The brand is Saphire, though I haven't been able to find a manufacturer's website. I suspect (but do not know) that they may have something to do with the German retailer that I ultimately purchased mine from, www.smoking-shisha.de, first because Saphire make a "Smoking Shisha special edition" colour for all their bowls and secondly because that particular retailer seemed to have above average stocks of Saphire bowls and better sale prices than most of the immediate competition. Think it might be their own product, haven't asked. [url="http://www.hookahshop.co.uk/saphire-hot-shot-bowl-night-blue-p-2085.html"]Here's what a UK retailer has to say about them[/url], which is commensurate with the descriptions & explanations from German retailers. Edited February 5, 2011 by magick777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodsytheowl Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 I wonder how this work with the phunnel? I'm thinking that you would load it in the same way where you would just wrap about 8-10g around the center hole: [IMG]http://i54.tinypic.com/xc54wz.jpg[/IMG] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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