The Goza unfan club

[Chreees]

I wish Eric would join in on this discussion, but I know he's a busy man. He would have all the answers.

[littlec]

[quote name='Chreees' timestamp='1329275393' post='539046']
I wish Eric would join in on this discussion, but I know he's a busy man. He would have all the answers.
[/quote]

One would hope he would point out the fact that this is an opium pipe overseas and that the gauge of a hose doesn't affect nicotine %s

[StayTru20]

[quote name='littlec' timestamp='1329280214' post='539049']
[quote name='Chreees' timestamp='1329275393' post='539046']
I wish Eric would join in on this discussion, but I know he's a busy man. He would have all the answers.
[/quote]

One would hope he would point out the fact that this is an opium pipe overseas and that the gauge of a hose doesn't affect nicotine %s
[/quote]

Hmm, I'd like a source that says that it's used as an opium pipe.

[Chreees]

From my observation, that would seem accurate to me Christian, hose gauge not affecting nicotine %...

[littlec]

[quote name='Chreees' timestamp='1329289663' post='539064']
From my observation, that would seem accurate to me Christian, hose gauge not affecting nicotine %...
[/quote]

I blame weak lungs and a weak view on what is really happening here. You take smoke in easier with an open draw, which I will admit the goza might have a slight advantage in that department. But this is only beneficial if you are unable to draw that much smoke into your lungs with a more restrictive pipe. I smoke nawras all damn day, I get just as much smoke as anyone else because I have strong lungs. Thus, when I smoked the goza, I noticed no increase in buzz. Edited February 15, 2012 by littlec

[Floataround]

[quote name='littlec' timestamp='1329298940' post='539071'] [quote name='Chreees' timestamp='1329289663' post='539064'] From my observation, that would seem accurate to me Christian, hose gauge not affecting nicotine %... [/quote] I blame weak lungs and a weak view on what is really happening here. You take smoke in easier with an open draw, which I will admit the goza might have a slight advantage in that department. But this is only beneficial if you are unable to draw that much smoke into your lungs with a more restrictive pipe. I smoke nawras all damn day, I get just as much smoke as anyone else because I have strong lungs. Thus, when I smoked the goza, I noticed no increase in buzz. [/quote]

While this makes sense, weak lungs are not the answer to this for me. I can only speak for myself, but I have very strong lungs and very strong breathing control. I have been practicing pranayama for quiet some time, and I am also a firefighter. I know how to utilize all of the muscles in my lungs, as well as lung capacity.

But lets assume that hose gauge is not a factor. What about the other bamboo factors? I cant say what kind of filtering, or lack of filtering the bamboo has. We know that with some types of hoses the leather or materials can absorb or hold things on the way to taking a draw. Do we have any information on what the bamboo might, And then to get very scientific, I am still interested to see how the smoke vapor composition breaks down after its produced.

Now the opium thing...I find interesting. I would also like a source. Because lets not forget..one - all hookahs can be used for different things I am sure, and this is still a hookah. I can easily put an ash tray around it, and plug a hose into the port, and then the only difference is the lack of a glass vase as the goza just uses the rounded bottom. And if that one difference is enough to change the effect of using NHT in it (over a "standard" hookah pipe. I dont even want to use that work because at the end of the day, this IS a hookah), then the possibility must exist that something goes on to create a larger buzz. But all it might come down to is shape and size, I dont know, thats why I asked for a source. I dont think that is really a relevant factor, but that's just me. I bet there are just as many people here using hookah's bought in local shops to smoke NHT as their are using goza style hookahs for opium, assuming they are.

[S3cretz]

Its going to be a while before I can get the vid up. Ive got year end reports to finish.

So here goes a very short summary of my findings on why, or why not the Goza could affect buzz.

FIrst off nicotine is not the only thing that gives you a "buzz"
There are 2 main things that give you a "buzz" :

1. Obviously nicotine. Although nicotine takes a lot of different actions throughout your body, what it does in the brain is responsible for both the good feelings you get from smoking, as well as the irritability you feel if you try to quit

2. The amount of smoke you inhale directly affects the amount of oxygen you inhale this coupled with smoke residue in your lungs leads to you having less oxygen in your bloodstream witch means your Brain and body arent getting enough oxygen. This makes the body go into standby mode and your senses dull less vital functions deactivate and if this goes on for long enough you go into coma then death.(the heat of the smoke also has an effect on this I however need to do more research before I can explain why)

So I hope you can see where im going with this.

There is no way that I can prove that the goza affects nicotine levels. Except for the above mentioned factor where in a few normal hookahs some* nicotine gets absorbed by leather or goatskin. However 90% of the hoses out there are synthetic so using this argument you can just say "want bigger buzz use a synthetic hose!".

So Im veering towards siding with littlec this is about the volume of smoke. The wider gauge means more smoke more smokes means more nicotine maby* but it definitely means that you get less oxygen.

[Floataround]

[quote name='S3cretz' timestamp='1329321101' post='539076']
Its going to be a while before I can get the vid up. Ive got year end reports to finish.

So here goes a very short summary of my findings on why, or why not the Goza could affect buzz.

FIrst off nicotine is not the only thing that gives you a "buzz"
There are 2 main things that give you a "buzz" :

1. Obviously nicotine. Although nicotine takes a lot of different actions throughout your body, what it does in the brain is responsible for both the good feelings you get from smoking, as well as the irritability you feel if you try to quit

2. The amount of smoke you inhale directly affects the amount of oxygen you inhale this coupled with smoke residue in your lungs leads to you having less oxygen in your bloodstream witch means your Brain and body arent getting enough oxygen. This makes the body go into standby mode and your senses dull less vital functions deactivate and if this goes on for long enough you go into coma then death.(the heat of the smoke also has an effect on this I however need to do more research before I can explain why)

So I hope you can see where im going with this.

There is no way that I can prove that the goza affects nicotine levels. Except for the above mentioned factor where in a few normal hookahs some* nicotine gets absorbed by leather or goatskin. However 90% of the hoses out there are synthetic so using this argument you can just say "want bigger buzz use a synthetic hose!".

So Im veering towards siding with littlec this is about the volume of smoke. The wider gauge means more smoke more smokes means more nicotine maby* but it definitely means that you get less oxygen.
[/quote]

Are there any other factors other than nicotine that get absorbed by leather or other affects that synthetics can have?

[quote name='Stuie' timestamp='1329321259' post='539077']
Can I ask a question?

I understand the gooza thing, but Where did the Panda thing come from?
[/quote]

Just because of the bamboo haha. Someone started it, and we just ran with it.

[Hassouni]

Bamboo is for eating (and scaffolding, in HK), not for smoking!

[king_lunchb0x]

[img]http://robrimes.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/img-haters-gonna-hate-panda-352.jpeg[/img]

[Floataround]

[quote name='king_lunchb0x' timestamp='1329324656' post='539088'] [img]http://robrimes.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/img-haters-gonna-hate-panda-352.jpeg[/img] [/quote]

+9000

[Skoozle]

Does the "goza buzz" go away when you use a normal hose?

[Floataround]

Do you mean switching the bamboo out mid session, or using a hose from the start?

[littlec]

[quote name='Floataround' timestamp='1329311157' post='539073']
While this makes sense, weak lungs are not the answer to this for me. I can only speak for myself, but I have very strong lungs and very strong breathing control. I have been practicing pranayama for quiet some time, and I am also a firefighter. I know how to utilize all of the muscles in my lungs, as well as lung capacity.

But lets assume that hose gauge is not a factor. What about the other bamboo factors? I cant say what kind of filtering, or lack of filtering the bamboo has. We know that with some types of hoses the leather or materials can absorb or hold things on the way to taking a draw. Do we have any information on what the bamboo might, And then to get very scientific, I am still interested to see how the smoke vapor composition breaks down after its produced.

Now the opium thing...I find interesting. I would also like a source. Because lets not forget..one - all hookahs can be used for different things I am sure, and this is still a hookah. I can easily put an ash tray around it, and plug a hose into the port, and then the only difference is the lack of a glass vase as the goza just uses the rounded bottom. And if that one difference is enough to change the effect of using NHT in it (over a "standard" hookah pipe. I dont even want to use that work because at the end of the day, this IS a hookah), then the possibility must exist that something goes on to create a larger buzz. But all it might come down to is shape and size, I dont know, thats why I asked for a source. I dont think that is really a relevant factor, but that's just me. I bet there are just as many people here using hookah's bought in local shops to smoke NHT as their are using goza style hookahs for opium, assuming they are.
[/quote]

I believe the goza/NHT thing can be summarized like this, you bought the equivalent of a roor "waterpipe" and are claiming it's meant for "pipe tobacco" which sure that's how it's marketed but everyone knows better.

Also that's good that you practice breathing and stuff but that doesn't necessarily mean you can draw more smoke into your lungs. I've smoked with athletes, swimmers and the like and they can't as big of a hit as I can, especially when there is resistance. It's a little different then just breathing straight air in my experience.

[quote name='S3cretz' timestamp='1329321101' post='539076']
Its going to be a while before I can get the vid up. Ive got year end reports to finish.

So here goes a very short summary of my findings on why, or why not the Goza could affect buzz.

FIrst off nicotine is not the only thing that gives you a "buzz"
There are 2 main things that give you a "buzz" :

1. Obviously nicotine. Although nicotine takes a lot of different actions throughout your body, what it does in the brain is responsible for both the good feelings you get from smoking, as well as the irritability you feel if you try to quit

2. The amount of smoke you inhale directly affects the amount of oxygen you inhale this coupled with smoke residue in your lungs leads to you having less oxygen in your bloodstream witch means your Brain and body arent getting enough oxygen. This makes the body go into standby mode and your senses dull less vital functions deactivate and if this goes on for long enough you go into coma then death.(the heat of the smoke also has an effect on this I however need to do more research before I can explain why)

So I hope you can see where im going with this.

There is no way that I can prove that the goza affects nicotine levels. Except for the above mentioned factor where in a few normal hookahs some* nicotine gets absorbed by leather or goatskin. However 90% of the hoses out there are synthetic so using this argument you can just say "want bigger buzz use a synthetic hose!".

[b]So Im veering towards siding with littlec this is about the volume of smoke. The wider gauge means more smoke more smokes means more nicotine maby* but it definitely means that you get less oxygen.[/b]
[/quote]

It is, but you don't need a piece of bamboo to pull in more smoke you just need to hit it harder. I also think you're getting more oxygen though since you're pulling more air through at a faster rate which in my experiences with the goza and other wide gauged hookahs you can't fill that space with solid smoke so the smoke/clean air ratio is higher.

I think the whole Goza thing is purely placebo. Edited February 15, 2012 by littlec

[S3cretz]

[quote name='littlec' timestamp='1329329672' post='539098']
I think the whole Goza thing is purely placebo.
[/quote]
I love that word placebo

In all honesty It could be. But until someone can get down to testing it properly. meh :/ Im not choosing sides(This is not a fight its a scientific Debate) Edited February 15, 2012 by S3cretz

[littlec]

[quote name='S3cretz' timestamp='1329330277' post='539100']

I love that word placebo

In all honesty It could be. But until someone can get down to testing it properly. meh :/ Im not choosing sides(This is not a fight its a scientific Debate)
[/quote]

[img]http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4016611/RHF/bill-nye-meme.jpg[/img]

[Ststudz]

Isn't the point in smoking shisha to relax? I understand there are "buzz's" while smoking them but to me that's not what it's all about. It's a social thing that brings people closer together. If you're there with a splitting headache and feeling like your head is about to hit the ceiling because it feels so light. To me that's not the enjoyable side of shisha. If the Goza is causing fighting and bickering just because of the buzz they claim they get. Why be butt hurt over if it does or doesn't? It's their choice, just find comfort in the fact that you smoke shisha not for the buzz but for the social aspect and flavor. :3

[Floataround]

[quote name='littlec' timestamp='1329329672' post='539098']
[quote name='Floataround' timestamp='1329311157' post='539073']
While this makes sense, weak lungs are not the answer to this for me. I can only speak for myself, but I have very strong lungs and very strong breathing control. I have been practicing pranayama for quiet some time, and I am also a firefighter. I know how to utilize all of the muscles in my lungs, as well as lung capacity.

But lets assume that hose gauge is not a factor. What about the other bamboo factors? I cant say what kind of filtering, or lack of filtering the bamboo has. We know that with some types of hoses the leather or materials can absorb or hold things on the way to taking a draw. Do we have any information on what the bamboo might, And then to get very scientific, I am still interested to see how the smoke vapor composition breaks down after its produced.

Now the opium thing...I find interesting. I would also like a source. Because lets not forget..one - all hookahs can be used for different things I am sure, and this is still a hookah. I can easily put an ash tray around it, and plug a hose into the port, and then the only difference is the lack of a glass vase as the goza just uses the rounded bottom. And if that one difference is enough to change the effect of using NHT in it (over a "standard" hookah pipe. I dont even want to use that work because at the end of the day, this IS a hookah), then the possibility must exist that something goes on to create a larger buzz. But all it might come down to is shape and size, I dont know, thats why I asked for a source. I dont think that is really a relevant factor, but that's just me. I bet there are just as many people here using hookah's bought in local shops to smoke NHT as their are using goza style hookahs for opium, assuming they are.
[/quote]

I believe the goza/NHT thing can be summarized like this, you bought the equivalent of a roor "waterpipe" and are claiming it's meant for "pipe tobacco" which sure that's how it's marketed but everyone knows better.

Also that's good that you practice breathing and stuff but that doesn't necessarily mean you can draw more smoke into your lungs. I've smoked with athletes, swimmers and the like and they can't as big of a hit as I can, especially when there is resistance. It's a little different then just breathing straight air in my experience.
[/quote]

Sorry, but I still don't buy into the NHT thing. Honestly it just seems like a smear against the goza because you don't like it. But lets be realistic. Its a HOOKAH! Anything that can be smoked in any other model KM, any brand egyptian, turkish, syrian, or anything else you can think of, can be smoked out of the goza, and vice versa. So whatever NHT you are referring to can be smoked out of any and all of your pipes just the same as it could my Goza.. It IS meant for hookah tobacco just like any other hookah, because its a hookah!

Using your reasoning (which I would still like a source btw) is no better than the majority of our society thinking that the main and intended use of a hookah is for NHT of sorts, as well as saying that a Hookah and various NHT paraphernalia are the same thing. We all know that hookahs are hookahs and nothing else, and that they are all intended for Hookah Tobacco/product (if you look at herbal lines such as Hydro or Steam Stones).

So to imply that "everyone knows better" is IMO, very incorrect. Because if that was, then out Hookas would have a much more common name that starts with a B, as well as being used for NHT only. Thats what the (uneducated) majority says. We know that is incorrect. I have also not seen anyone else say it is used as an Opium pipe, so until i can see not just a source, but many sources, I dont think that even falls into the category of "everyone"

Oh, and very cool picture Mush would you happen to have the rest of the article still? Edited February 16, 2012 by Floataround

[Hassouni]

To correct C, hookahs can't be used for opium, from what I know.

[Chreees]

Mush, what did you notice in terms of buzz when you smoked your Goza?

[Hassouni]

So first off, I'd like to point out that I'm leaving it out of the Panda club thread, out of respect to Floataround. I realize it may come off snobby and biased, but this is just my honest perspective as someone of Arab descent, who's smoked all over the Middle East. I mean no offense by it, and I just thought it should go in a separate thread from the one created for those who enjoy the product. Regardless, many of you know how I feel, but I thought I'd clarify and elucidate my feelings:



[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][color="#333333"]1. It's crude and primitive, and in its place of origin is seen that way doubly so. It's the equivalent of deliberately using a rotary phone or driving a shitty non-classic old car, or deliberately acting destitute. Having been all over the Middle East, which is generally not a wealthy place (except for pockets like Dubai, but even there there's a lot of poverty), only the most down and out can be seen smoking goza-type devices. This is RARE, and I suspect only happens when a regular nargile is not affordable...but remember a basic nargile there is CHEAP CHEAP CHEAP. Wonder why it has a round bottom? Because it's meant to be lodged in the sand/dirt.[/color][/font]


[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][color="#333333"]2. Nargile is supposed to be relaxing. It shouldn't be something you do for a fix when you have real stuff to do, such as driving somewhere or cleaning up, or whatever. If you're at the point where you're truly addicted to nicotine, surely there are easier, quicker ways to get a fix. And if you want the enjoyment of smoking the nargile, isn't it more enjoyable when you can sit back and not worry about anything?[/color][/font]


[font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif][color="#333333"]3. Building on point 2, having to hold it defeats the purpose of relaxing, and putting it in a stand that has to be purchased separately negates the whole point of its existence. Why have a round bottom goza if you are going to get a stand? As an analogy, would you use a glass without a flat bottom? What if you wanted to put the glass down for a second? I see it as rather similar.[/color][/font]

As for the bamboo, I don't know if that filters less, or more, or it's wider or what, but I also sort of like being able to sit at a distance from the pipe and maybe change angles and whatnot.
As for the buzz, I'm not even going to address that since so many others already have.

[joytron]

I understand those are reasons why you would not buy a goza, but I am just curious why it offends you if other people do?

[mustang67n]

I, too, don't understand the Goza craze. But I do have to agree with Jess here. The panda's like their goza's, you do not. Why is it such a big deal?

[Chreees]

Guys, Chris is just stating his opinion on them. This is a forum after all, remember? He's doing it in such a way that doesn't disrespect anybody. It's a good topic that should be discussed I think, and I hold Chris's thoughts in high regard because I know he's been to the Middle East and knows a thing or two.

The "pandas" can talk about why they like it, so Chris should be able to talk about why he doesn't. Not everyone is going to like the same stuff. That's why there are different products and why competition exists. Without it, we'd have a rather bland society, don't you think?

That said, I find the analogy to a drink glass a very good one.

[Hassouni]

Nate and Jess: If people want to have one, let them. But others are wondering why there's so much backlash. These are my reasons