weigh-in for various of 50g packets

[azcoyote]

The package says 50 g NW.

[gunsboy]

[quote name='azcoyote'] [quote name='angemonkwj'] going above and beyond the norm is always good. we try to do the same in our business to.[/quote] What your line of work?[/quote] - You don't like to mention names when not needed to.- You own an accurate scale (Ohaus dial-o-gram). - Your first test of the purchases was a weigh-in. - You are familiar with the plastic sealed baggy weight.- In your busines, you always try to do a little more than expected to keep your reputation.MMMMMMM, I could only guess your line of work!!!

[azcoyote]

[quote name='gunsboy'] [quote name='azcoyote']  [quote name='angemonkwj'] going above and beyond the norm is always good. we try to do the same in our business to.[/quote] What your line of work?[/quote] - You don't like to mention names when not needed to.- You own an accurate scale (Ohaus dial-o-gram). - Your first test of the purchases was a weigh-in. - You are familiar with the plastic sealed baggy weight.- In your busines, you always try to do a little more than expected to keep your reputation.MMMMMMM, I could only guess your line of work!!! [img]smileys/smiley2.gif" align="middle" /> [/quote] These days I actually make a living as an upholstery shop owner and I do most of the work myself. If you ever want a fancy padded hookah bag I have many remnants of upholstery fabric which sold orignally from 30 to 60 $/yd. There may not be enough to do a recliner, but a hookah bag would only take a couple of yards. . I could offer a custom padded duffel bag in premium fabric for around $90 plus shipping.. I am thinking of some designs for this since I bought a 39" tall monster hookah with six hoses locally. Probably will use ultrasuede since it's so easy to clean and nearly indestructible. I'll use 1/4" closed cell foam for extra protection and a series of snap tabs to hold the hookah fast in the case. Unfortunately i have a shop full of jobs and it may be a while before I can endulge in such personal projects. I take no offence at your inference. I weighed the packages becuase I could actually feel the differences in hand. Then I just had to know. You see I used to work in a deli and I could scoop up a quarter pound of say "coleslaw" and usually be within a couple percent of the intended weight. Especailly if i'm doing so repeatedlly Someone who is hand packing shisha in an Egyptian sweatshop could come within a couple grams every time. If that was their intention. It seems all the errors are in their favor. A bad finding.I purchased the scale over twenty-five years ago. It's been used for a variety of purposes in that time. My experiences back in the '80's with certain nasal snuffs certainly may have influenced the way I approach issues of accuracy in trade today. The scale is but an old and reliable relic of those times. Ahh the memories! [IMG]smileys/smiley36.gif[/img]

[Sonthert]

I have been saying this for a long time, people! Of course, everybody knows I am biased and lie profusely to make my own shabby product look better. Al Amir has always been just about dead on, from my weigh-ins, but Nahkla, Layalina, Al Fahker have fared badly. I actually removed the tobacco from the bags to weigh it. I wondered about Al Waha, now we know. I nevered wondered about Al Ajamy, but well, OK. When confronted by the shortness of weights in his packages, the owner of Layalina said "Oh, the employees are pinching again, pinching." Bull. They could steal it in bulk and then cover each package. These packages are short because management wants them that way. How much do you guys really save by shorting each of 30g? As for Tangiers, I always squeeze a little extra in, so I don't have to worry about some crazy man with a scale. Of course, I am concerned with my reputation and honesty. This guy is right, he's looking out for us. This is the United States of America, people (or Canada or Great Britain, hi international friends!), they think they can short change us and get away with it? They think nobody will stop them because nobody has a gun pointed at their nuts if they screw up. If there is exactly one thing I would say I didn't like about making maasel, honestly, it would be I'm always competing on a slanted field because these guys short their packages 10-40%. Its become standard to be able to compete in price.

[azcoyote]

Thank you Tangiers for adding your experience to this discussion. I suggest that all reviews include a weigh-in. where possible. This will keep the issue in the spotlight and hold makers feet to the fire. Repeated statement of short weighting will eventually have an effect.Until then, I will only buy AA, AW and I certainly will give Tangiers a try. In fact, it's next on my list to try.

[EvansLight]

looks like my food scale is actually gonna get some use now

[djnick]

fumari shorted me big time on my order, about 5g less on each one, guava was about 8g less than 100 with noticible empty space in the container

[azcoyote]

[quote name='djnick']fumari shorted me big time on my order, about 5g less on each one, guava was about 8g less than 100 with noticible empty space in the container[/quote] And they are a "premium" brand. Add them to the shame file. I hope you bring this to their attention. It will help put an end to this crap eventually. Since I started this thread yesterday already well over 200 shisha consumers have read about this. It's a start. Maybe the powers that be here will see fit to sticky this so keep it in people's minds. They say sunlight is the best disinfectant.

[GQ_Playboy]

bloody ridiculous... i hate that they are premium brands also.... they are charging more and for what? to short change us a few grams... thats absurd.. i wonder about starbuzz... with their $20 for 250g prices they better not be shortchanging anyabody!

[azcoyote]

[quote name='Johnny_D']This is very disappointing! However I guess that not all countries have weights & Measures acts ?  However, if the vendor is selling within a country that [b]does[/b] have an act like this, then they may well be responsible for ensuring products are correct (or at least withing a resonable %age) and 28% is way off the mark!  Just my 2p.  JD[/quote] There are several government bodies that could come into play in this case. NIST is National Institute of Standards and Technology. They operate the Bureau of Weights and Measures. BWM investigates complaints as they come in regarding discrepancies in weight, quality and purity of ingredients, etc. The NIST was established specifically to insure a level playing field for US producers competing against imported goods. Together with the Imigrations and Customs Service (ICE) they have the authority to refuse shipments that do not comply with US standards.I think the offending companies would start instituting quality control after only a few container loads are denied entry at a US port.Once tobacco items enter the country, they are still subject to the authority of BATF - Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms. They have the authority to pull merchandise off retail shelves, padlock warehouses etc. until the matter is sorted out. Their process is also complaint driven.A vindictive person could have a field day.

[DizzyGuy]

I'd be too afraid that that'd drive prices way up :/

[azcoyote]

Maybe in the short term if there is a shortage. Price only reflects supply and demand conditions. If imports raise thier prices too much they will lose market share to domestic producers. The result? More income for the US economy, more jobs and incomes here in the good old USA. What's so wrong with that? US makers will have added incentive for improving their products to fill the void and build brand loyalty.We sell a shitload of Marboros and Camels worldwide because these brands deliver the quality world markets demand. If we set our standards high enough, we could become a net exporter of Shisha. It's a renewable resource, you know.Metaphysically speaking, money is a kind of energy exhange. There is a loss of self respect and dignity whenever when one knowingly gives financial support to those who screw them, especially when there is a ready alternative. If the landlord won't fix the leaky pipes, how do you FEEL about paying the rent? I'd feel like moving.And behind our back, somewhere in the middleast a rich tobacco merchant chortles gleefully to his pals:"Oh, Those stupid Americans! They have no balls! I take their money and spit on them! Ptuey!"Let the price go up! You will see a better quality smoke that you can enjoy with pride! [IMG]smileys/smiley32.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley32.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley32.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley32.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley32.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley32.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley32.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley36.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley36.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley36.gif" align="middle" /> [IMG]smileys/smiley2.gif" align="middle" />

[DCShisha]

Forcing imported products to meet NIST standards does not in any way hurt the consumer. Prices may go up a bit but the quality (or maybe the quantity in this case) of the product will at least be consistent. azcoyote is 100% on the mark here.

[Sonthert]

Its not BATF anymore, its TTB.They only deal with undertaxation. In California, this issue is regulated by the State Attorney General.

[azcoyote]

[quote name='Tangiers']Its not BATF anymore, its TTB.They only deal with undertaxation. In California, this issue is regulated by the State Attorney General.[/quote] Thank you for bringing me up to date on this.

[Macho555]

Did Nahkla ever get in touch with anybody to try and explain themselves?? I'm glad Layalina is at least closer than some of the other weights. But the Nahkla weight makes me nervous.

[azcoyote]

[quote name='Macho555']Did Nahkla ever get in touch with anybody to try and explain themselves??  I'm glad Layalina is at least closer than some of the other weights. But the Nahkla weight makes me nervous.[/quote] They have not yet responded to my email. Probably closed for the weekend. The addy on the box was atefiby@nahkla.com. It was not returned as undeliverable so I assume it's waiting to be read in atefiby's inbox. Of course the more mail they get on this the better. They can easily dismiss me as one cranky comsumer. . I sent them a link to this thread, so they can hear how outraged we are about this. If we hear nothing, then it's safe to assume they don't give a rat's ass. And that's ok too. Just so we know where we stand.My total experience with shisha is very limited, about three weeks to be honest. I've been in the world long enough however to size up this situation. Tangiers posted here that it's a common practice among imported brands to short consumers 10 to 30 percent. In another post Havana, a premium brand (domestic, if I'm not wrong) failed to deliver on weight by 8 grams. There is absolutely no excuse for this.Anyone who sells their product retail should demand an explanation and a WRITTEN APOLOGY TO BE POSTED IN THEIR STORE. Every arab market I've been to has a certified scale for olives, halvah or any bulk food purchase. If this is where you buy your shisha have them put it on the scale. If they refuse, they are part of the problem. If they agree they will be very embarrassed and apologetic. The distributors will not like the angry words from their retailers. It will go up the ladder. If I had a retail shop or internet business, I'd put it all Nahkla and Layalina on sale for 25% off and tell consumers the truth about it. Layalina deserves no different treatment. They should hear our indignation. It's an emotion well understood in that part of the world. Layalina is in the UAE. I think their distributor in SA would probably lose a hand if he short-weighted the wrong prince. I'd guess their goods destined for SA are are weighed more accurately than ours. They see no consequences for screwing us. Only more profit. It's a no brainer. Unless we take a stand, we'll get more of the same. I will get the ball rolling with NIST if all else fails.Let's roll...

[Seandoo]

agreed.

[djbomberto]

WOW, no wonder why my shisha looked a lil skinny

[Sonthert]

One dishonest guy started shorting, so others followed to keep up. Thank you Al Amir for being honest! Keep it up. In California, the counties regulate weights and measures. They only insure, however, that the measuring device is true and correct, not that the dishonest prick behind the scale is true and correct. Its a matter of pinching pennies anyways, its absurd. I've gone over it a hundred times...anything you do is going to be an enforcement nightmare or ineffectual because those guys are several continents over.I also advocate the weigh in as part of reviews...sneak it over to a store with a digital scale...nobody will know.

[azcoyote]

A WORD FROM THE SELLER:Thanks Dan,> I will pass the word on and hope it reaches Dubai and Cairo. This has been a> problem, Tangiers asked about it a while ago and Layalina told me, it was a> human packer issue some more and some less, but it probably is a mistake> primarily in their favor. I will tell Layalina that the public is talking> poorly about them that they are ripping off their customers. Hopefully they > will start respecting their base before the lose them. As far as Nakhla I> will tell the importer but he will blame the other non-distributors who> bring 200g and 150g packs from Jordan and other areas. I hope by bringing > this up to the industry manufacturers will think about being reputable and> fair to the public, as we start holding them accountable. If they had to> raise the price a quarter per 50g that would be fine they just need to be > honest. If you have any other companies that are doing this as well, please> let me know so I can tell the importers and distributors. Thanks>

[Sonthert]

I think I'm gonna take a scale over to Hookah Company and start weighing packages of tobacco, for fun. I weighed the Sultan that was sent by Evans light.249.8g Sultan melon250.1g Sultan capuccinoPerfect! Thats what you would expect as far as errors go. a variance of a couple tenths of a gram are more than reasonable. When they start always being 5-10g short, there must be an obvious intent to short. I weighed an Al Fahker 50g that weighed in at 45g some time ago. Layalina 250g weighed in at 211g. 250g of Al Amir blackberry weighed in at 250g.

[azcoyote]

How does one delete an erroneous post from a thread? Forgot to use quotes in previous post. oops.

[azcoyote]

[quote name='Tangiers']I think I'm gonna take a scale over to Hookah Company and start weighing packages of tobacco, for fun.  I weighed the Sultan that was sent by Evans light.  249.8g Sultan melon250.1g Sultan capuccino  Perfect! Thats what you would expect as far as errors go. a variance of a couple tenths of a gram are more than reasonable. When they start always being 5-10g short, there must be an obvious intent to short.  I weighed an Al Fahker 50g that weighed in at 45g some time ago. Layalina 250g weighed in at 211g. 250g of Al Amir blackberry weighed in at 250g.[/quote] Thanks for the information..Very revealing I think. Let's all take a look at the facts.

[Sonthert]

Let me know how contacting the NIST goes.